Would this detour you?

Discussion in 'THE Gretsch Discussion Forum' started by cosmicCowboy, Feb 19, 2021 at 9:33 PM.

  1. mbkri

    mbkri Country Gent

    Sep 22, 2012
    Chicago
    Wow! Can someone who knows about wood and finishes help me understand how there’s no damage to the face of the headstock? I just cant understand that.
    Is it possible that it’s just severe cracking in the nitro but not in the wood?
     
    Back in Black likes this.
  2. Frisco Kid

    Frisco Kid Electromatic

    91
    Aug 6, 2010
    DFW
    I’d have to pass...would be in the back of my mind the entire time I’d own it.
     
  3. audept

    audept Senior Gretsch-Talker

    Age:
    73
    Dec 1, 2010
    Sydney, Australia
    Honestly, I think this would be my reaction too.
     
    thunder58 likes this.
  4. G5422T

    G5422T Country Gent

    May 24, 2012
    usa
    IIRC, these have an overlay on the face. Maybe a the wood cracked, and the overlay flexed??
    @cosmicCowboy I understand a model being your "heaven," but it coukd be "Hell" too.

    A proper neck repair, structurally and cosmetically, plus the cost of this guitar would be VERY close to an undamaged one.

    Best of luck with your hunt.
     
  5. Bertotti

    Bertotti Friend of Fred

    Jul 20, 2017
    South Dakota
    So let me get this straight he has pictures of the before and after, so what pictures are at the beginning of the thread? Repaired? If that is the finished work I would walk right by. I have seen pros fix head stocks and the crack was virtually invisible others not as much. The pictures, in the beginning, don't look all that pro to me.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021 at 6:43 AM
  6. Limuz

    Limuz Gretschie

    403
    Sep 8, 2012
    Netherlands
    If the pictures in the first post are after repair, I’d hard pass on it. Looks like a hack job, really.

    This repair here is barely visible, and the headstock wasn’t even attached.

     
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  7. Ricochet

    Ricochet I Bleed Orange

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    Big pass unless you can get it for 1200, and even so, it’s a risk.
    A bad neck repair is worse, than the actual break, and regardless of his claim this is no pro repair.
     
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  8. El Marin

    El Marin Gretschie

    226
    Oct 4, 2018
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    I would pass

    He did the repair, he is a pro... that's the wrong answer. The right answer would be: I did, I am a pro. This is my (web, FB IG) and this is my Visit Card. You can check my jobs here and there.

    I mean, if he wants to offer you guaranty and confident of him being a pro, he should had given you much more information, about himself and thousands of pics of the repair.

    I fixed some guitars and got some money from some friends... does it make me a pro? Do ya get me?

    Luck in your decision, mate
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2021 at 3:48 AM
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  9. Robbie

    Robbie Friend of Fred

    Age:
    67
    Jun 17, 2013
    Sarnia Ontario Canada
    Think I’d let this guitar go to someone else
     
  10. Jardin

    Jardin Electromatic

    17
    Jan 8, 2021
    NM
    Unless you can vet him as a "pro" and he can give you assurance that not only that the job was done properly and backs it up some how....I would say hard pass....

    That is unless you plan to do whatever it takes to have that neck replaced or repaired in the future. What I start to wonder is why did he not finish the job? If he is a "pro", I just do not see why the finish would be left the way it is??????

    I build instruments and sell them, but I do not throw around the word "pro" and I would not want to do such a repair to such a high end instrument as it can go severely wrong in a quick hurry and its a different skill set. The number of things that can go wrong with making a scarf joint properly during a build is one thing and the details matter....the number of things that can go wrong repairing a scarf joint that has broken is just a different set of details and the stakes are higher as the joint is already failing....

    If my guitar broke like that, under my care, I would have to keep it even after a proper repair. But to turn around and sell it for as much as I can get for it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

    **I am aware I am making assumptions here as I do not know the whole deal so I wanted to at least admit that. Take this all as seriously as you do a clown speaking babble. But this is just where my mind goes.**

    So if you decide your a gamblin man, the million dollar questions for me would start as:

    1) Did it break while in your possession and was there any explainable reason (i.e. dropped, banged against a wall or just a joint failure)? Or did you purchase it broken to repair and sell?

    2) Why was the finish not repaired as well?

    Sorry but I do not buy the: "I did not find it ethical to make it look right, so I left it visible." The repair to the finish can be done properly and still disclosed in the sale, so that is a bunch of horse manure in my mind. I would accept the I'm good with structural repair (with solid proof) but not a finish guy as they are different skill sets and not all "pros" have both skills.

    3) What exactly was the extent of the repair? Here you are trying to sus out if we are talking about a crack filled with glue and clamped (likely from what I ca see here) or are we talking about a removal of the head-stock overlay, scarf joint and a full re-glue (highly doubt it from what I see in those pictures) or any other explanation as there several ways this could have gone. No matter the answer, you need to see those before and after pictures to see how bad it was before the repair. Pictures during the surgery are necessary here so there is at least some proof of the repair process...What kind of glue also matters here and can tell you a lot about the longevity of the repair.

    4) Is there some sort of written guarantee of the work? If not why not?

    5) I would want some other proof of this persons work outside of saying they are a pro. (i.e. testimonials that can be traced to someone you can communicate with, photos of past work for others, invite to their shop (little more difficult these days).

    In the end a pro who buys a damaged guitar to repair or has a damaged guitar to repair and sell should also fix the finish or have it fixed. It does not have to be perfect but to not even try????

    From what I see here, my gut says tempting.... but Hard Pass but again if you like rollin dem bones.....ask some questions and blow on them dice before you lay money on the line.

    Best of Luck CC!
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021 at 9:02 AM
    MotorCentaur likes this.
  11. Bertotti

    Bertotti Friend of Fred

    Jul 20, 2017
    South Dakota
    Does Gretsch use a scarf joint? I can't see any grain in this picture so I can't tell and I do not know how they actually do it. But I do wonder if they actually use a scarf joint.

    To me, it looks like someone just squeezed some glue and then twisted it back together with no other prep or work involved. Heck, what glue was used?
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2021 at 9:10 AM
  12. LongJohn

    LongJohn Synchromatic

    656
    Apr 22, 2016
    Queens, NY
    No thanks, not the last guitar on earth, more are sure to follow.
     
    capnhiho likes this.
  13. mschafft

    mschafft Synchromatic

    717
    Jan 19, 2017
    Switzerland
    I would consider buying it if I was a pro luthier or knew one willing to restore it perfectly.
     
  14. Bertotti

    Bertotti Friend of Fred

    Jul 20, 2017
    South Dakota
    Not at that price, it will cost a fair bit to get it fixed properly and with the repair that’s been done it could be even more involved.
     
    mschafft likes this.
  15. thunder58

    thunder58 Super Moderator Staff Member

    Age:
    62
    Dec 23, 2010
    tappan ny
    Admin Post
    It is for me . You couldn't give me that guitar even if it was for free . Even if it was me who cracked a headstock , I'd probably strip the guitar for parts and then throw the guitar out .
    Just something about a cracked headstock . And then try and sell it in the future ...........
    Did you ever get in a car accident ? Got the car back from the body shop and guess what ?? The car was never the same ....just my opinion
     
    Shock likes this.
  16. Jardin

    Jardin Electromatic

    17
    Jan 8, 2021
    NM
    I can say my 5422TG has a scarf joint.....But I do not know on that model and this could be above the scarf joint after looking a second time.

    By the way: They are perfectly good joints if done properly. When executed properly, they can be stronger than some one piece necks (depending on grain run-out and a whole host of other variables beyond the scope of this discussion). However, they (like all methods) sometimes fail. But to make the point on why it matters that someone knows what they are doing..... something as simple as sanding the joint in the wrong direction and you fill the grain with sawdust and the glue does not wick in properly to make a strong bond. Building instruments (to me anyway) is all in the details.

    I can say there are people out there who can repair this guitar properly (regardless of whether it is a failed scarf joint or a broken head-stock) and for all I know this person is one. However, without proof and assurance.....I would not waste my (or their) time as it looks like a crack that was filled with glue in one of the most structurally vulnerable places on a guitar. At least from what I can see here in this post.
     
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  17. Bertotti

    Bertotti Friend of Fred

    Jul 20, 2017
    South Dakota
    Exactly! Nothing wrong with scarf joints, the few I have seen fail didn’t actually fail at the joint but the wood around the joint and generally from some abuse. It is possible to fix this and have it perform better than new. But like @Jardin says the devil is in the details. I wouldn’t let a good repair stop me from buying it but this does not look like a good repair. Honestly it looks like a complete hack job to me.
     
    capnhiho likes this.
  18. Henry

    Henry I Bleed Orange

    Apr 9, 2014
    Petaluma
    If he is a pro, then he should have a reputation to discover locally. If this were being offered by someone I trust, then I would trust the repair.
     
    Bertotti likes this.
  19. swivel

    swivel Country Gent

    May 13, 2018
    PNW
    Wouldn't detour me at about half normal price maybe.
    White is a bit hard to match, but not as hard to hide that crack in white as in natural finish I think...? If your goal would be to make it disappear. Otherwise, if glued well it should play fine.
     
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