Setzer's exact echo time

[Tremolo Arm]

Does anyone know the exact go-to echo time (in milliseconds), which Brian Setzer uses live for his standard tone?

I have searched this long and hard, and whilst there is a lot of info on his gear (Roland Space Echo, Fender Bassman, etc.) I cannot find the exact echo settings he uses on the Roland. I mean you can see photos of the unit with his settings illustrated, but what does that equate to in milliseconds?
The info I've seen always points to some approximation, such as "quick slap back with one repeat" or "between 60ms and 120ms", etc. but I am really interested in knowing the exact time in millisecond and exact repeats.

When you watch him live, he hardly touches his Roland unit, which suggests he sticks to the same setting throughout the gig (except for Sleepwalk, which changes the echo time dramatically).

Thanks

 

[cielski]

If anyone knows, it'd be Tavo.

 

[Byron]

I'm the Hot Licks Dvd/VHS, he describes it as three fast repeats....duh duh duh. That film never seems to make it onto YouTube for some reason

 

[Pops]

You want his “secret sauce” recipe for tone?

 

[Tremolo Arm]

If anyone knows, it'd be Tavo.

Who's Tavo?

 

[cielski]

Who's Tavo?

That would be fellow member Tavo Vega, maker of fine pedals, and a serious Brian Setzer fan.

 

[NJDevil]

I'm guessing 60ms is too quick.....it's too close to the Haas effect for doubling which is around 30 - 40ms. It is quick though I'm thinking around 100ms to 140ms. That's my best guess.

 

[Tremolo Arm]

Thanks. It would be indeed interesting to hear his opinion!

That would be fellow member Tavo Vega, maker of fine pedals, and a serious Brian Setzer fan.

 

[thunder58]

Calling @TV the Wired Turtle

 

[ruger9]

It's interesting that (according to above) he states "3 repeats" in the Hot Licks video... every interview I've ever read (which is all from the founding of the BSO forward) he states "one quick repeat". Maybe that's to keep things clearer with the big band?

When playing alone, I too prefer 3 quick (and quiet) repeats... it's more of a cross between echo and reverb at that point.

 

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Does anyone know the exact go-to echo time (in milliseconds), which Brian Setzer uses live for his standard tone?

I have searched this long and hard, and whilst there is a lot of info on his gear (Roland Space Echo, Fender Bassman, etc.) I cannot find the exact echo settings he uses on the Roland. I mean you can see photos of the unit with his settings illustrated, but what does that equate to in milliseconds?
The info I've seen always points to some approximation, such as "quick slap back with one repeat" or "between 60ms and 120ms", etc. but I am really interested in knowing the exact time in millisecond and exact repeats.

When you watch him live, he hardly touches his Roland unit, which suggests he sticks to the same setting throughout the gig (except for Sleepwalk, which changes the echo time dramatically).

Thanks

my nerd bell wrang'd..

Setzer has in interviews said 1-3 slap back but w the first being the main w the other two faded. in his words or sounds "BAH-Pah-pah" and he's guess-imated 115mS..
When I also tried to interview him about his set up trying to pin him down on if he was gigging w a Boss DM-2 or Boss DM-3 he said he couldnt remember, but it sat down at the corner of his amp.

btw. also you sort of dont get "exact" time because its a tape echo and the tape both stretches and the motors never turn revolutions at the same speed, and he is always switching
between them as they all fail EVERY tour. Tom Jones told me he was left w 3 functioning units after the last tour, which he was also bringing 2 of these Re-201s which
he just doesnt use, or record with.


PS. Plus on record its shared that on his songs he's gone into the studio to record, he has the engineer lay echoplex over the mix. So you are hearing both his
RE-301 space echo AND then echoplex on top of everything. Its not surprising how bright his live tone is versus his recorded tone. RE-301 preamp is quite bright, left untamed.

this is his rig, latest studio recording. amp sitting several feet away.. probably just scratch tracking



this was his settings for a 68' comeback era gig in OC. not a BSO show.



A more recent shot of the BSO settings



china marker days




PS. I got better pics of the rig on stage but having trouble at the moment, ggrrrr... here's a nice one while you wait....... (cue combustible edison elevator music)

 

[Tele295]

I'm guessing 60ms is too quick.....it's too close to the Haas effect for doubling which is around 30 - 40ms. It is quick though I'm thinking around 100ms to 140ms. That's my best guess.

I think it’s in there somewhere. One notable difference between a 301 and an Echoplex is the Roland’s big dial, which allowed kinda lopsided echos and rolling triplets, etc. Some of those settings were usable, and some were not. I think the RE-20(?) space echo pedal had the same options.

 

[TV the Wired Turtle]

I think it’s in there somewhere. One notable difference between a 301 and an Echoplex is the Roland’s big dial, which allowed kinda lopsided echos and rolling triplets, etc. Some of those settings were usable, and some were not. I think the RE-20(?) space echo pedal had the same options.

here is the operational manual btw:

https://soundgas.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Roland-RE-301_Operators_Manual.pdf

 

[thunder58]

Thank you Tavo @TV the Wired Turtle

 

[Tremolo Arm]

View attachment 204688
my nerd bell wrang'd..

Setzer has in interviews said 1-3 slap back but w the first being the main w the other two faded. in his words or sounds "BAH-Pah-pah" and he's guess-imated 115mS..
When I also tried to interview him about his set up trying to pin him down on if he was gigging w a Boss DM-2 or Boss DM-3 he said he couldnt remember, but it sat down at the corner of his amp.

btw. also you sort of dont get "exact" time because its a tape echo and the tape both stretches and the motors never turn revolutions at the same speed, and he is always switching
between them as they all fail EVERY tour. Tom Jones told me he was left w 3 functioning units after the last tour, which he was also bringing 2 of these Re-201s which
he just doesnt use, or record with.


PS. Plus on record its shared that on his songs he's gone into the studio to record, he has the engineer lay echoplex over the mix. So you are hearing both his
RE-301 space echo AND then echoplex on top of everything. Its not surprising how bright his live tone is versus his recorded tone. RE-301 preamp is quite bright, left untamed.

this is his rig, latest studio recording. amp sitting several feet away.. probably just scratch tracking
View attachment 204686


this was his settings for a 68' comeback era gig in OC. not a BSO show.

View attachment 204687

A more recent shot of the BSO settings

View attachment 204690

china marker days

View attachment 204689


PS. I got better pics of the rig on stage but having trouble at the moment, ggrrrr... here's a nice one while you wait....... (cue combustible edison elevator music)

Amazing info. Thanks so much

 

[Viper]

Just throwing this out there. Is it possible to overthink this stuff?

 

[J Bird]

No, not at all. And, at the same time, of course.

 

[gasmoney]

Tavo
Whe you said Setzer would run a finished song through an exhoplex-how is that done ?
I read the fabulous thunderbirds did that too.

What is the actual process ? Plugging an ep2 into the board ??

 

[YourBlueRoom]

View attachment 204688
my nerd bell wrang'd..

Setzer has in interviews said 1-3 slap back but w the first being the main w the other two faded. in his words or sounds "BAH-Pah-pah" and he's guess-imated 115mS..
When I also tried to interview him about his set up trying to pin him down on if he was gigging w a Boss DM-2 or Boss DM-3 he said he couldnt remember, but it sat down at the corner of his amp.

btw. also you sort of dont get "exact" time because its a tape echo and the tape both stretches and the motors never turn revolutions at the same speed, and he is always switching
between them as they all fail EVERY tour. Tom Jones told me he was left w 3 functioning units after the last tour, which he was also bringing 2 of these Re-201s which
he just doesnt use, or record with.


PS. Plus on record its shared that on his songs he's gone into the studio to record, he has the engineer lay echoplex over the mix. So you are hearing both his
RE-301 space echo AND then echoplex on top of everything. Its not surprising how bright his live tone is versus his recorded tone. RE-301 preamp is quite bright, left untamed.

this is his rig, latest studio recording. amp sitting several feet away.. probably just scratch tracking
View attachment 204686


this was his settings for a 68' comeback era gig in OC. not a BSO show.

View attachment 204687

A more recent shot of the BSO settings

View attachment 204690

china marker days

View attachment 204689


PS. I got better pics of the rig on stage but having trouble at the moment, ggrrrr... here's a nice one while you wait....... (cue combustible edison elevator music)

I love you Tavo

 

[cielski]

Just throwing this out there. Is it possible to overthink this stuff?

I had the same thought. It may just be, "Close enough for government work."