Moral delema

Discussion in 'Fred's Barcalounge' started by noelweller, Jun 27, 2008.

  1. noelweller

    noelweller Banned

    Age:
    48
    Jun 25, 2008
    schaumburg
    For me this a a sticky situation. As most of ya'll know from either talking to me or other post. I have only been playing for 4 months now. I have a great teacher in the respect that he see's my weeknesses and builds on them, also i have no problems saying where i struggle for the week, I have lessons for 30 minutes once a week. I get along with him and he is a nice guy etc... this is where i am having issues though. I am noticing in his words. " i just give you some scales and some chords and let you go, Cause you are figuring out alot on your own" While I am sure that is a good thing that I am doing that. I find that there is a lack of structure. The biggest issue I am having and it is really bugging me is, I am trying to learn rockabilly, which he knows nothing about, So when it comes to questions on runs, turnarounds etc.. he doesn't have the answers i need. I also want to learn travis picking, he had never heard of it till i brought it up to him. Part of me feels loyal to him because yes he is a good teacher and he has really helpt me make leaps and bounds. The other part says in the long run he is hindering my playing. So go back and forth on the issue if I am holding myself back by having a teacher who knows nothing about what I am trying to learn. Or take what he is giving and keep on figuring the rest on my own. So my head hurts from thinking so much about this I figured I would ask all you good people for some grounded advise.
     
  2. getbent

    getbent Super Moderator

    Jun 1, 2008
    sunny california
    keep taking lessons, but start looking for another teacher. You need someone who can teach thumb style... and rockabilly, go find them. You are in a large metro area.... they are definitely out there... once you've found a new teacher, give this guy a months notice or whatever and move on.
     
  3. MGllm

    MGllm Synchromatic

    From a distance, it sounds like you have a guitar player that teaches lessons. Go find a real teacher that has a breadth of knowledge about guitar playing, technique AND music. Even if you are learning the basics, a good teacher will be able to show how what you are learning will apply to your aspirations.
     
  4. ptrallan01

    ptrallan01 Electromatic

    16
    Jun 8, 2008
    Elgin, IL
    Talk to Justin

    All of his instructors seem to have degrees in music, but like many, they are limited in style. Maybe one of the others has what you need. The current instructor has helped you improve dramatically according to what you said so don't "dis" him. You may even want to ask him if one of the other instructors knows anything about the techniques your looking for. If that doesn't work you can try talking to the folks at the music store on Golf Road in Elgin Um Weaver's is there name. They generally have multiple guitar instructors. Another choice is in Streamwood. I don't know the name of the shop but they are on Streamwood Blvd and Park I think. There is also the music shop off Irving Park Rd east of Roselle Rd on the south side of the street.

    One thing to remember is this is rock and roll territory and finding country style instruction can be difficult. There was a guy in the GC in Arlington Heights who was doing some fine hybrid picking, I have his card "somewhere". If I find it I'll get you his information.
     
  5. JC higgy

    JC higgy Gretschified

    Age:
    51
    Jun 6, 2008
    Belfast Norn Iron
    Yep, time for a new teacher.
    you've went as far as you can go with this one.

    Its something i've never done ,take lessons, my dad showed me my first chords then off i went!
    Same problem here though,no one played fingerstyle a'la Chet and Merle,so i had to teach
    myself!

    I'm just an ear player really ,everthing i've learned has come from listening/playiing along to records and videos,and now the interweb ,youtube and the like.
     
  6. bobframe

    bobframe Synchromatic

    941
    Jun 3, 2008
    US
    While I offer no particular answer to your dilemma, I will suggest the following. If you have to ask yourself "Do I need a change here", the answer is almost always "Yes". And if you ask yourself "Do I have a problem"- the answer is usually "yes".

    In other words, listen to your heart- it knows there's a problem way before your brain does.
     
  7. gretschiam

    gretschiam Gretschie

    144
    Jun 6, 2008
    Chicago
    FWIW, I have mixed feelings about lessons anyway. I've taken lessons three times in my 42 years of playing (first guitar and first set of lessons started June 25, 1965- think I consider it important?). Each time I've stayed with the teacher about three months, and each time the teacher pushed me up to a new level. Later, some friends I really respect said they thought that might be the best way for a lot of guitar players. You need the expertise of someone to get you off the plateau, but guitar is a mastering process that requires tons of personal practce, experience and whenever possible playing with other people.

    I've also given lessons off and on over the years. I generally have tried to follow that rule myself and push the student away after a few months or after I think I've done what I can for the moment. They can always come back.

    My suggestion is that you thank the guy and just stop for awhile. Try a couple of instructional DVDs- I HIGHLY recommend "Travis Picking" by Paul Pigat. It's the best I'v seen for that style, and it's available at www.learnrootsmusic.com

    You can always go back or try someone else, but take a breather to digest what you've learned most recently. And when this really works for you and you become a superstar, I expect to be invited to play with you on tour.
     
  8. Pappy

    Pappy Country Gent

    Age:
    38
    Jun 4, 2008
    Georgia
    I tried lessons once and told the instructor I wanted to learn rockabilly. "Like Brian Setzer?" Now, to be honest, he's not the first person that comes to mind but he'll do in this case so I say yeah and he goes "great!" And then what does he send me home with?

    Metal.

    I already knew how to play fast, palm muted chug chug chug stuff. I didn't need lessons on that and I wasn't looking to shred.

    I gave him one more shot and it was more of the same so I said adios.
     
  9. bobkat

    bobkat Country Gent

    Age:
    62
    Jun 2, 2008
    Valparaiso Indiana
    Noel, I agree with these guys, Bob frame nailed it, if you are asking yourself then it is time to move on. I also recommend Paul Pigat and watch U Tube. I have picked up so much just from watching U Tube! Check out the Setzer videos, and mimic him. I play some chicken pickin sort of like Jim Heath or Brian. I learned to finger pick when I was 16 from a teacher but when he wasn't challenging me I moved on.
     
  10. Synchro

    Synchro The artist formerly known as: Synchro Staff Member

    Jun 2, 2008
    Tucson
    Admin Post
    I think that whether or not to take lessons depends upon the person. Some people prosper learning on their own and others need lessons to impel them.

    To my sensibilities this sounds like a good state of affairs. When I was an instructor I loved to teach students that could learn on their own and use me to monitor their progress and to keep them from developing bad habits. When used like this an instructor can keep you from wasting a lot of time. IMO this is the best situation.

    At 4 months in I wouldn't be too freaked about the fact that he's not into Rockabilly. Right now you need to learn the basics, things that are fairly universal. There's no magic formula for Rockabilly, it builds upon common elements and combines them into it's own unique mix.

    When it comes to selecting an instructor the waters can get very murky indeed. Everyone wants to learn what they want to be able to play and most people want to learn it as soon as they possibly can. In my experience, anyone that tries to teach a specific style from the very beginning is wasting the student's time. Learning the basics, scales, chords and arrpegios is the best possible use of your time at this stage.

    OTOH, there are plenty of teachers out there that teach songs. It does work, to an extent, but I see that as having a greater risk of being a time waster. After all, if all you are learning is songs you run the risk of becoming completely dependant upon someone else every time you want to learn a song. I would avoid this at (almost) any cost.

    From my viewpoint as a guy that's given a lot of lessons I would say that you have a good instructor right now. Hang on to this guy for a while and see where it leads you. Rockabilly isn't going anywhere and once you have learned more of the basics you should be able to apply it to Rockabilly fairly easily.
     
  11. Twang

    Twang Electromatic

    Age:
    57
    87
    Jun 4, 2008
    Arlington, VA

    If I were you, I'd stay with this teacher while you look for a replacement teacher who can teach you more Rockabilly stuff.

    In the meantime I agree with bobkat, get one of the Paul Pigat videos and work through it. IMHO he is a great teacher and an amazing player. I have and love both of his vids.

    www.learnrootsmusic.com

    No affiliation, just a satisfied customer and fan.
     
  12. bobframe

    bobframe Synchromatic

    941
    Jun 3, 2008
    US
    By the way Noel, I see no moral dilemma at all. Your teacher is selling a product and if that product does not meet your needs, then you should stop buying it. No one in their right mind expects to sell you something that's not meeting your needs, whether it's music lessons or jet engines. No morality involved- just supply and demand.
     
  13. Farmerbrown

    Farmerbrown Gretschie

    400
    Jun 23, 2008
    Elizabethtown, Ky
    I'll second the Paul Pigat videos, I took some thumb picking lessons this past winter and have learned much from them, but I have learned much more recently by watching youtube videos.
     
  14. noelweller

    noelweller Banned

    Age:
    48
    Jun 25, 2008
    schaumburg
    Wow guys you have been very helpful here, along with long talks to my best friend back home.

    I had a long talk with my teacher, I believe a smart move, and expressed my concerns over some coffee and about a pack of smokes. Now that we talked I understand what he was and is doing. It is like sure he could teach me songs and I can jam all day, but when push comes to shove that's all i would be. He feels I have lots of talent and ideas and he doesn't want to hinder that, hence giving me alot of freedom to develope my own style and if he sees something wrong he steps in. in his words" for the amount of time you have been playing your way ahead of the game and i love to see what brilliant ideas I am coming up with" I was really taken back by this. sure stroke my ego and I am all yours LOL... WE talked about Paul Pigot dvd. He is going to purchase that so he as well as me can benifit from it.

    I feel I guess I wasn't looking at the whole picture as my best friend said, And I agree with this, I would rather develop into my own that be a clone of someone. both my teacher best friend and a few others clued me in on that one.

    Also in our talks I was discussing that fact my head plays notes and rythems my hands don't know yet, hence why i was really really frustrated. I felt I should know those things. He let me in on the fact, as a few others did, what i am playing in my head is what someone playing for atleast a year is doing and i am trying it at 4 months.

    It is amazing what sitting down for a few hours and going over every aspect of what i expect and what he expects, and reasons for treating my lessons the way he does. BTW he says he normally doesn't handle lessons in the manor and me.

    So now that i understand I am going to stick with him for awhile and see what happens.
     
  15. noelweller

    noelweller Banned

    Age:
    48
    Jun 25, 2008
    schaumburg
    As some as you know, Gretshiam being one for sure. this is were I am at. sound clips are always better than words can describe

    http://www.myspace.com/brianmadarya4track

    And you know Gretschiam. you won't have to be invited, I would be insulted if you didn't pack your bags and be ready go when i mention it.
     
  16. Synchro

    Synchro The artist formerly known as: Synchro Staff Member

    Jun 2, 2008
    Tucson
    Admin Post
    I told you he was a keeper.
     
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