Jensen’s vs Celestion’s in 2x12 cabinet

Discussion in 'Ampage Area' started by Tennessean85, Oct 11, 2020.

  1. Tennessean85

    Tennessean85 Electromatic

    12
    Jul 7, 2015
    Idaho
    What would I expect from the differences between Jensen American speakers and Celestion British speakers in a 2x12 speaker cabinet. It’s the low power tweed twin sized and it’s open / closed back with removable back baffles for either. I know original brownface blonde cabinets had oxfords or others, tweed twins had P12N’s, and Setzer has vintage 30’s. Amp is a tweed bassman 5f6A. If I had a 2x12 cab with something like Jensens how would that sound and how would that compare with a 2x12 cab with something like celestions. What do people like in the tweed bassman? I’m not talking about Jensen and celestion specifically, can be any brand speaker like weber or WGS, but let’s call this the Jensen vs Celestion discussion.
     
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  2. TV the Wired Turtle

    TV the Wired Turtle Gretschified

    Jul 25, 2009
    so cal
    In having both bassman closeback 212 cabs with dual P12n's, open back 212's w them compared to celestions and webers (speaking of only alnico speakers here because V30s are no where near the same construction as these speakers) The P12N's have lovely compression but being reissues they are very pristine and have too much bite for blonde and tweed amplifiers, worse w vox amplifiers in closeback cabs.. That said they have a sweet clean open sound in the 212 open back cabs, w good breakup..still too strident for my ears. Weber Chicagos are closer to the vintage Jensens my ears are used too. Celestions Gold and blue duo are remarkable for a tweed amp but I find
    Weber Silverbells a better match when it comes to alnico. The V30 cant enter this debate because of its a large ceramic magnet and heavily doped (for closeback cabs at loud volume) speaker cone. Yet I'll say damn its voiced so well for tweed and blonde/brownface amplifiers. The dual P12N's in my bandmaster cab and blondebandmaster were surftastic but still so damn bright, I couldnt handle it. That same speaker though in my recapped 65 deluxe reverb was perfection! ..I'll come back tomorrrow, I need sleep I'm ramblin :)
     
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  3. wildeman

    wildeman Gretschified

    May 10, 2015
    norcal
    Don't forget Eminence speakers, i have a few and they are most excellent. I don't have a bunch of experience with the Italian Jensens but what i do is not favorable, i do have considerable experience with vintage Jensens and those ain't it.
     
  4. Tony65x55

    Tony65x55 Gretschified

    Age:
    64
    Sep 23, 2011
    The 'Shwa, Ontario, Canada
    Hi there T85 and welcome to Gretsch Talk. I have a low power twin - very similar to the tweed Bassman. I have used a bunch of speakers in it and at the moment it has P12Ns. My buddy has one with C12Ns in it and it sounds terrific too but louder for sure. The P12Ns are not very efficient.

    I have a few Bassmans and currently I am re-speakering my 1961 with two P10R Jensens. They sound absolutely fabulous in the Bassman amps. Another good speaker is the Eminence 1028K 10" speakers. I have a 2x10" cab loaded with Eminence Red Fang ceramics and it is stellar and very efficient/loud. I am running a couple of different heads through it, most notable a 1968 Traynor YBA-1 - which is based on Bassman architecture and sounds very similar. I can't say enough good things about this speaker. It's a real sleeper.

    Lately, I've decided that the 10" speakers meet my needs better than most others
     
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  5. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    The main thing is they both sound good depending what sound you are looking for.
    For me I think the old American made Jensens sound best in open back cabinets.
    The Celestions sound real good in closed back cabinets.
    If you really want clean and tight the old JBL alnico K 120s sound wonderful in my mid 60s Fender 2-12 cabinet. Less harsh than the Celestions and even tighter than the Celestion vintage 30s.
     
  6. swivel

    swivel Country Gent

    May 13, 2018
    PNW
    Well, anything from Greenback to others may work well. It kinda takes a starting point to recommend a change though. Some speakers will add bottom, some wont etc. What do you have tone wise and where do you want to go from there? I'm hard pressed to recommend a modern Jensen though.

    Some of my favorite 12's are:
    Emi GA SC64
    Weber Silver Bell
    Greenback (not for too much power though)
    Emi Red White and Blues
    Emi V - warmer top end
     
  7. pmac11

    pmac11 Country Gent

    Mar 4, 2018
    Toronto, Ontario
    A lot depends on the cabinet, but for open backs I've had good results with
    WGS G12C
    WGS G12C/S
    Celestion A Type
    Eminence Texas Heat

    If you want to try the upscale hempcone market, I have nothing but good things to say about Tone Tubby. I've got a 4040 (40W ceramic) in an open back 112 pine cab, and a GMC (80W alnico) in my Mesa F50. Limited website, odd marketing, great product. If you email them and ask, they can usually recommend a good match for your amp and cab.
     
  8. lathoto

    lathoto Gretschie

    270
    Apr 23, 2020
    Ohio
    Dial me up a pair of them EVM12L's!
     
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  9. Waxhead

    Waxhead Country Gent

    Aug 30, 2014
    Australia
    How can anyone have a general discussion/comparison between these 2 speaker makers when they both make a very wide range of different sounding and different designed speakers? :D
     
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  10. BCRatRod73

    BCRatRod73 Gretschie

    213
    Sep 1, 2020
    Mississippi
    +1 for Eminence speakers. I have two 12” Redcoat Guv’nors in my Peavey Classic 50. I have a 12” Red White & Blues For my Bugera V22. Eminence makes some good speakers.
     
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  11. pmac11

    pmac11 Country Gent

    Mar 4, 2018
    Toronto, Ontario
    Sure, toss logic and common sense into the mix... ;-)
     
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  12. Tennessean85

    Tennessean85 Electromatic

    12
    Jul 7, 2015
    Idaho
    I’ll give a little bit of background to better explain what I am looking for, hopefully it will be helpful as it’s a little bit all over the place I know. Every 2x12 amp I have played I have really liked, Among them were the supersonic with the sealed V30’s and the JTM45 with the open back greenbacks. I also really liked the tweed twin with the weber 12A150-A built by eminence, that was what started my path down the tweed road. My amp is a custom made bassman and it's 25 watts so just about any speaker will do. I have a combo 2x12 cabinet, I was trying to keep the weight down so I first got a pair of weber 12A125-S, I didn’t really like the small magnet alnicos, I liked clean but I didn’t like the way they break up.

    So I switched to Jupiter 12SC’s which I currently have. I am planning on taking the chassis out for a head cabinet. I'm not worried about the weight of the cab now and would prefer a larger speaker, the small magnet jupiters just don’t have the solid low end that the larger speakers would. For the sound I am looking for I like a bold punchy bass but that doesn’t get flubby, then clear and articulate and I think I like the woody low mids. I’m a little shy about alnico speakers now after the Weber 12A125 but maybe it’s just the small magnet alnico that I don’t like because I liked the tweed twin with the larger alnico speakers, but it was just dry at a music store when I played it. I seem to like all the ceramic speakers and they don’t compress like alnico but will a 30-40oz alnico magnet even compress with just a 25 watt amp? Also with moving to a head it gives me the opportunity to get a sealed cabinet. I’m just looking to see what I could expect from british style speakers and American style speakers and trying to determine what would be best for me. Thanks for everyone’s input.
     
  13. cowmoo

    cowmoo Country Gent

    Aug 19, 2011
    North Wales
    I prefer the pair of Jensen p12r in my half open cab to the v30’s in the closed back with my bassman head, they just seem to have more character and air around them than the sterile v30’s
    I’m converting a 1x12” to a 2x10” though, and if that works will put the head into a whole new combo 2x10 for practicality.
     
  14. Tennessean85

    Tennessean85 Electromatic

    12
    Jul 7, 2015
    Idaho
    I should mention I play pretty clean with just a slight drive from a pedal, honey bee with minimal-moderate gain. I play pretty quiet too, I don't need super efficient speakers that will knock out a loud drummer or anything.
    My sound is pretty warm, bright too but I don't like it overly bright
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2020
  15. TV the Wired Turtle

    TV the Wired Turtle Gretschified

    Jul 25, 2009
    so cal
    Celestion G12H30's.. They have an oversized magnet and not overly doped, will break up and get creamy when pushed hard but remain sparkly and relatively tight n woody in the lows, yet give out that paper cone touch response of vintage speakers even at lower volumes and are well voiced for most all guitars. Beautiful cleans and love pedals. They lack the upper mids bark that is inherent in V30s, so in that they knod a bit towards greenbacks without being so classic rock.
     
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  16. Tennessean85

    Tennessean85 Electromatic

    12
    Jul 7, 2015
    Idaho
    Awsome, thanks TV. My buddy had a cab with a G12H30 (that was his speaker of choice) and I played it a couple times and always liked it. Would you recommend closed or open back, I can try both but just wanted to ask. Also would you recommend a Celestion or one of the other companies version? Thanks again
     
    TV the Wired Turtle likes this.
  17. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    I'm not TV but after reading your last post I think you should try the Eminence SC 64. After a week or two of playing the top end gets sweeter and the bottom end gets fuller.
    I like the G12H30 but the new ones are a bit on the bright side - old ones less so.
     
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2020
  18. TV the Wired Turtle

    TV the Wired Turtle Gretschified

    Jul 25, 2009
    so cal
    they sound absolutely fantastic in both open and closed. My friend Brian of Tophat amps would spec these in his vox clone "club Royale cabs mismatched with a green back, and from that I started putting G12H30 in my closeback bassman cabs that I played at home because they had such a great voice at lower volumes but kept me from missing nothing in the frequency spectrum. That said I would advise you to try to get an older one as they were actually built in england some 15yrs ago "ipswich england" is actually on the labels. the newer ones are great but they take a long time to "Seat" and for the cone to finally give that lovely dimensional bloom that broken in celestions are known for.

    YET.....

    Avatar speakers will sell you a celestion G12H30 with their label for $115 that has been physically broken in

    https://avatarspeakers.com/shop/speakers/avatarhellatone/hellatone-30/

    "
    We start with a stock great sounding classic 30 watt Celestion G12H30s. We then convert it into a Hellatone by exercising the suspension for 15 hours so when you get it, it has a warmer tone on the very first note. This process gives the Hellatone 30 an even richer low end than it already had. The model 30 has wonderful mids and highs and a beautiful overdrive tone. If you drive it hard, you get a real nice cone break up that sounds fantastic. Large heavy 50 oz magnet!

    “We love the Hellatones” ToneQuest Report
    "
    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Tennessean85

    Tennessean85 Electromatic

    12
    Jul 7, 2015
    Idaho
    One question I have that refers back to a thread I started just before this one, If I play a bass (electric and upright) through the 25 watt bassman head with the 2x12 cab will it blow the celes G12H30 speakers? I will keep the volume low, below 4 on the dial. I know the sound won't be great but just want to know if it will blow the speakers. Thanks again to everyone
     
  20. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    How much low end bass you put through those speakers will determine if they blow out or not. They are not bass speakers so they don't handle 60hz and below very well. They wouldn't be a speaker I would want to pump a low E through at any volume above 2 on a Fender Bassman amp.
     
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