"The True First Single Cut Ever Made"

Discussion in 'Fred's Barcalounge' started by Charlie westside, Jun 25, 2019.

  1. RocknRollShakeUp

    RocknRollShakeUp Synchromatic

    630
    Jun 20, 2017
    USA
    There is this one too!

     
    Stefan likes this.
  2. Stefan

    Stefan Country Gent

    Jan 20, 2016
    Germany
    Very interesting!
     
    RocknRollShakeUp likes this.
  3. Stefan

    Stefan Country Gent

    Jan 20, 2016
    Germany
    Maybe Leo was inspired by the Bigsby headstock. But the 1950‘s Esquire headstock

    7823D82E-3E67-4856-B48C-E0873B261CCE.jpeg

    looks pretty different. It follows the body shape. So remember that it was the headstock of the Strat that‘s similar to the Bigsby, 2 years later.
     
    RocknRollShakeUp and Merc like this.
  4. afire

    afire Country Gent

    When PRS started making a compact solid body guitar with a single Florentine cutaway, i.e., much like the Bigsby Travis guitar, Gibson sued them. Like I said, there's more to it than just the body silhouette, but that was a big part of it. PRS didn't really change anything else about their guitars other than going from double to single cutaway, and that was enough for Gibson to take them to court over. Did Gibson lift the Les Paul body style from Bigsby? Maybe, maybe not. But it certainly existed before the Les Paul. And before you point out that the body shapes of the Bigsby and Les Paul aren't identical, neither are the shapes of the PRS singlecut and the Les Paul.
     
    Charlie westside likes this.
  5. blueruins

    blueruins Country Gent

    May 28, 2013
    Savannah, GA
    Did they win that lawsuit?
     
  6. afire

    afire Country Gent

    No, they sure didn't. They fought it tooth and nail, though. They had success in the lower courts and did manage to get an injunction that lasted four or five years, during which time PRS was barred from making the Singlecut model. But in the end, they lost on appeal and the US Supreme Court declined to hear the case.
     
    Charlie westside likes this.
  7. Charlie westside

    Charlie westside Synchromatic

    954
    Jul 27, 2018
    Sylmar Califirnia
    What a shame. I understand That he went to Gibson Who told him none of his ideas would ever go anywhere.
     
  8. Charlie westside

    Charlie westside Synchromatic

    954
    Jul 27, 2018
    Sylmar Califirnia
    I have seen the Appleton. Yes looks like a LP. Or rather the LP looks like the Appleton. I believe he took the guitar to Gibson and they told him it wasn't marketable.
     
  9. blueruins

    blueruins Country Gent

    May 28, 2013
    Savannah, GA
    I’m out of this one...y’all are obviously too emotionally invested. That Appleton looks no more like a Les Paul than the Super 400.
    Gibson was dragged into the electric market because they thought a solid body was crude compared to their crafted instruments.
    The Les Paul was an attempt to catch up and show Fender and their ilk how to make a silk purse.
    Nobody had to show Gibson how to design a guitar for the love of Pete Thorn..:they’d been doing it for decades.
     
    Gretschtim1 likes this.
  10. Scooter127

    Scooter127 Gretschie

    497
    Feb 25, 2019
    USA
    I think for most things guitar, when you hear "first time" it's generally not exactly correct.
     
    blueruins likes this.
  11. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    Yeah man I said the same thing in the Gibson thread...:D.
     
    blueruins likes this.
  12. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    That thing don't look like any Gibson I've ever seen or played. If anything it's closer to a Strat than a Gibson.
     
    blueruins likes this.
  13. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    It must have been weird for Leo Fender to be told he couldn't use the "Fender" design....:D
     
  14. afire

    afire Country Gent

    Sure. That seems self evident, but it doesn't mean they didn't see what others with more visionary tendencies were doing to advance the art at the time. And thinking more about it, it does seem that somebody(s) did need to show Gibson how to design a guitar. Paul Bigsby, Leo Fender, and Les Paul. No doubt, Gibson nailed it when they finally came out with a solidbody. But it did take other pioneers to lead the way.
     
  15. calebaaron666

    calebaaron666 Country Gent

    Aug 15, 2018
    Portland, Maine
    That baby is beautiful!
    And it’s pretty obvious that the body resembles what a les paul body would eventually be, and the headstock is clearly a precursor to a strat headstock. C’MON!
     
    dak55, Charlie westside and RomanS like this.
  16. Ricochet

    Ricochet I Bleed Orange

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    You’re too emotionally invested...:)

    Doing it for decades? Sure but no electrics!
     
  17. Ricochet

    Ricochet I Bleed Orange

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    Fascinating. So he was shown the door a decade before Gibson actually had the idea to make an electric.

    What that tells me is Les Paul possibly instigated production of an electric, but actually had very little to do with the design. Something I’ve always wondered about if you look at the aesthetics of his other “inventions”. Including the “Log” they are very very crude.

    Interesting that the APP makes use of a truss rod, which is originally a Gibson patent from the ‘20s...
     
    JC higgy and Charlie westside like this.
  18. Charlie westside

    Charlie westside Synchromatic

    954
    Jul 27, 2018
    Sylmar Califirnia
    If anything, it sure is pretty cool to read about the origins of the one thing we all love so much around here the guitar.
     
    JC higgy and blueruins like this.
  19. wabash slim

    wabash slim Friend of Fred

    Age:
    69
    Feb 10, 2010
    lafayette in
    I'd say that this is the winner in the first cutaway contest.
     
    dak55 and Charlie westside like this.
  20. afire

    afire Country Gent

    Not quite so early, but while we're on the subject of early cutaways, I'm always happy for an excuse to post a picture of the coolest acoustic guitar ever made. The 1920s Epiphone Recording Model D:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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