End pin dilemma!

Discussion in 'Technical Side of Things' started by freddyfingers, May 4, 2019.

    Hi all. Just got this ES295, and trying to get used to a few things i have not encountered before. Mainly the end pin. The white knob thats supposed to hold a strap Why a company would put all the work into a “custom Shop “ guitar, sell it for crazy money, but expect someone to support it with this flimsy little knob. I tried too put a strap on it, and it quickly came undone. I know how to tighten it up and install better, but i want to do away with it and replace it with something secure and permanent. All my other archtops have set end pins, even the gretsch has a metal end pin, annoying to unscrew but it works. This one doesn’t seem the best. Would prefer to have locking strap buttons as well. Do i have to screw a small plate onto it, or are there other options?
     

    Attached Files:

    Jena and Merc like this.
  1. So there is a hole there now . . .

    how about an Erlewine solution
    "put wood in it" . . .




    (edit)jpg
     
    freddyfingers likes this.
  2. Ricochet

    Ricochet Gretschified

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    Not everyone likes the Schaller look but they work fine for me. If you want something more stylish maybe the Duesenberg strap locks? No need for a plate, and I'd wait with the wood filler till you have the new strap button screws in your hand. ;)

    [​IMG]
     
  3. Henry

    Henry Gretschified

    Apr 9, 2014
    Petaluma
    I have these and they are great. They combine strap locks like dunlop with the Gretsch style screw on retainer. Pricey but it won't break the bank.
     
  4. So I just screw those into the body?
     
  5. Robbie

    Robbie Country Gent

    Age:
    65
    Jun 17, 2013
    Sarnia Ontario Canada
    I have Schaller strap locks on all my guitars, both solid body and Semi. All I did was remove whatever strap buttons came with the guitar and screwed the Schallers in. The Panther came with them as standard. I had no issues installing them on my 355.

    Do what you feel is right, I’m just passing along my personal experience.
     
  6. loudnlousy

    loudnlousy Friend of Fred

    Age:
    53
    Oct 18, 2015
    Hildesheim, Germany
    The only problem that could happen here is that the frame has no further wood support for a long screw.
    Could you unscrew that plasic pin and show us what kind of screw is used herre?
     
  7. Ill take a pic in a bit. When the pin comes out, its just a quarter inch wide hole.
     
  8. Ricochet

    Ricochet Gretschified

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    Even full hollow bodies have a socalled end block to hold the two seams of the sides. I wouldn’t worry about it, much...
     
  9. rcboals

    rcboals Country Gent

    Nov 21, 2008
    Springfield Oregon
    Been their done that several times. Your ES-295 is made that way because that is how they came when they first started making them historic touch right? Use a 1/4" wood dowel small amount of glue fill the hole after it is in pre drill a small hole for your new end pin screws. Install the Schaller strap locks. If you ever want to go back to the historic style end pin it is an easy fix to drill out the dowel. It will be plenty strong to do this minor mod easy simple.
     
    mrfixitmi, freddyfingers and Sabato like this.
  10. benjwri

    benjwri Country Gent

    Age:
    81
    Oct 27, 2011
    Central ON Can
    Jena (way back at the start) has the best solution. The hole might be tapered in which case you would have to drill a suitable hole for say, a ¼" dia dowel. Fit and glue the dowel, give a day to dry, then pilot drill and screw in the button of your choice.
     
    new6659, Jena and freddyfingers like this.
  11. Henry

    Henry Gretschified

    Apr 9, 2014
    Petaluma
    Yes. Honestly, if you plan to use straplocks on your strap, then I wouldn't bother with the Duesenberg, since you are basically paying extra for the screw on part which does not work with straplocks.
     
    Jena likes this.
  12. Not sure if you need to make a slightly bigger hole first and fill it.

    I'd say don't jus' rescrew into the old hole with NOTHIN' of course,
    since weight bearing load on these screws.

    Maybe glue, or a drop of epoxy or mix a little wood dust with Elmers glue
    and insert the screw in while glue is still wet or re-screw when hard as a rock cured epoxy.
    You could put a sliver of wood in too with glue
    put that seems to move to one side so hard to predict the exact spot the screw would set.

    Although these are pickguard screw holes, and I have to re-fill them anyway since no screws goin' back in . . .

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    PS - these are photos of my NGD "unboxing", btw . . .
    even did a temp nut and restrung lefty while sun out.
    . . . that pickguard on the left side was jus' layin' there for the photo-op -
    but betcha you already knew that.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
    thunder58 likes this.
  13. radd

    radd Synchromatic

    952
    Dec 27, 2017
    Santa cruz
    I have changed to locking strap locks or changed to different strap buttons many times.

    The change can be easy, it can also present some minor problems if you don’t have a good feel for how a screw should fit and feel being screwed in. It should not be forced or go in to easy. I would strongly caution against glueing in the screw. If it ever needed to be replaced you may well rip out part of the wood removing it. Repaired, glued wood, is often times stronger than the original wood around it.

    I have glued in dowel inserts so I could drill a proper size hole. Again, not hard if you have a feel for drilling and can be sure you can drill straight, keeping the two planes, up/down, left/right in line so the button sits flush.

    The reason for my caution on such a simple job is that I sense you have little experience doing repairs like this. I apologize if I am wrong about that.

    Another caution, just using tools and power tools around a guitar requires you to place protective material around where you are working to avoid damage from a tool that slips.

    A luthier could fix it right up in no time for you.
     
    freddyfingers, new6659 and Jena like this.
  14. It looks like it is the same as a pickguard-sized screw but much longer.

    Wood dust with Elmer’s Titebond carpenter’s glues seems popular -
    and so it would still be harder than wood that you’d be screwing right back into, right?
     
    benjwri likes this.
  15. benjwri

    benjwri Country Gent

    Age:
    81
    Oct 27, 2011
    Central ON Can
    Should have check before I posted above. Had the idea this was one of the old style with the tapered shank...which are larger in diameter and press in. If it is just a screw hole then yeah...wood dust and Elmers!
     
    Jena likes this.
  16. It was suggested that i remove the white plug, save it, unscrew the lower screw from the tail piece, and screw in another strap holder/lock there. If i ever sell it, remove the strap lock and reinsert the white plug. Sounds simple enough.
     
  17. mrfixitmi

    mrfixitmi Synchromatic

    587
    Mar 20, 2010
    Michigan
    All of our Guitars have Schaller locks. I have seen too many custom sound holes through the years that were created when the strap falls off the button. Repairing the hole with a dowel rod and wood glue is preferred. Never had an issue with Schaller locks, nor have any of our customers that use them. I love the look of the original Gretsch knobs, but not the aftermath when the button is cross threaded and the guitar crashes into the floor. The plastic buttons seem to slip more than the steel pins. We also install Schaller locks on our acoustic guitars.
     
  18. I was looking for the safest and strongest , without butchering up the original quality.
     
    Jena likes this.
  19. OK, no custom sound holes preferred for me.

    So, is Schaller the only, or most common, locking strap button / post maker ?

    I already have plenty of wood dust available (to mix with glue or epoxy) for repair of holes, after the big rosewood plugs needed for the bridge stud posts were cut.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2019
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