DrumBob's Article on Counterfeit Guitars

Discussion in 'Fred's Barcalounge' started by drmilktruck, Dec 5, 2018.

  1. drmilktruck

    drmilktruck Gretschified

    May 17, 2009
    Plymouth, MN
    Long time (but former) member DrumBob aka Bob Cianci wrote this article for Premier Guitar in 2009 about the counterfeit guitar market in China. I came across it while cleaning out my Safari reading list. I think others will enjoy it.

    https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/The_Growing_Problem_of_Counterfeit_Guitars?page=2
     
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  2. LivingMyDream

    LivingMyDream Country Gent

    Good article. How many of us, who might build a reputation for whatever it might be, would like it if someone was pretending to be you, and doing harm to your reputation? If they want to build guitars, build them, and establish their own reputation. Unfortunately, there are too many that are willing make money off of someone's else hard earn reputation.
     
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  3. Sid Nitzerglobin

    Sid Nitzerglobin Country Gent

    Jun 8, 2015
    fROMOHIO
    I love the screed in the comments like "Want us to not buy counterfeits, don't charge $1000 for a US strat cuz my $200 Squier is just as good"

    This kind of thinking is a very large part of why we make basically nothing in the US anymore in my view.

    I apologize and please delete if that's too political...
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
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  4. Alberta_Slim

    Alberta_Slim Gretschie

    195
    May 18, 2018
    Ontario
    Movies, music and microcode - you still excel at those!

    Free Xmas gift to anyone who can identify my source. No Googling! :)

    EDIT: aw hell, that's silly - of course Google is permitted. First correct answer.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
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  5. wabash slim

    wabash slim Friend of Fred

    Age:
    69
    Feb 10, 2010
    lafayette in
    Great article! At what point does a tribute become a counterfeit? If you think you're going to get a $3000 guitar for $300, you're sadly mistaken.

    Caveat Emptor. Do your due diligence and don't get scammed.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2018
  6. thunder58

    thunder58 Gretschified

    Age:
    60
    Dec 23, 2010
    tappan ny
    " Screed " ?? You don't know Bob like I know Bob .... lol
     
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  7. thunder58

    thunder58 Gretschified

    Age:
    60
    Dec 23, 2010
    tappan ny
    As most of you know , Bob and I are good friends ( think I'll buy him an Italia Strap for Christmas ) Bob is very knowledgable in the field of counterfeit guitars , wierd and wacky guitars but most of all drums . He writes for a few magazines besides working full time and also is a gigging guitar / drummer . He's also wrote a book I think is called " great rock drummers of the 60's " . I called him last week but he was just sitting down to lunch . He's always asking for he guys here on the forum .
    Good article to post @drmilktruck , thanks
     
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  8. Sid Nitzerglobin

    Sid Nitzerglobin Country Gent

    Jun 8, 2015
    fROMOHIO
    For me it's when they start putting the original manufacturer's logos/trade dress on them and add fake serial #s. Non-licensed tributes still have a bit of an ethical hairball to deal w/ IMO, but not nearly as big and sticky as the out right forgeries.
     
  9. Sid Nitzerglobin

    Sid Nitzerglobin Country Gent

    Jun 8, 2015
    fROMOHIO
    This is most certainly true ;) To be honest though I must have missed most of his objectionable to someone posts/rants.

    I liked pretty much every thing I read from him on here whether I was in complete agreement w/ his POV or not.
     
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  10. Jockabilly

    Jockabilly Gretschie

    Age:
    46
    272
    Sep 15, 2018
    Argyll
    One thing I notice in that article is the Rickenbacker chap's reference to Fender 'producing their own 'cheap knock-offs' in the Far East'. I must admit I often puzzle over just how I feel about the fact that, although it may say Gretsch, Fender, Epiphone, Ibanez etc. it is not made by workers trained specifically to build those models directly by the owner of the brand. I have owned and currently have some fantastic far eastern made guitars and banjo's with USA brand names but there is always a part of me that says - This isn't actually a Gretsch, Fender etc. it's a copy of a Gretsch, Fender etc. ordered by Gretsch, Fender etc. and actually made by craftsmen at Samick or Saein or Fuji Gen Gakki etc.
     
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  11. drmilktruck

    drmilktruck Gretschified

    May 17, 2009
    Plymouth, MN
    I suppose that the difference is that if the original manufacturer orders it, then it's a real model, otherwise it's a fake. However I agree that outsourcing guitars to foreign subsidiaries who pay their employees poorly is not exactly a morally upright position.

    Several years ago my wife and I were looking for a new disposal for our sink. I was at Sears and happened to find a document which was obviously a training form for new employees. It said that all disposals are made by the same company, regardless of the brand. So you should only buy based on horsepower. That spoke volumes to me about how disingenuous businesses are.

    90% of all glasses are made by one company, regardless of brand. There is little difference, so you should buy by price, not brand. Most multinational companies are in on the game.
     
  12. Jockabilly

    Jockabilly Gretschie

    Age:
    46
    272
    Sep 15, 2018
    Argyll
    It's the same in many areas. Most fridge compressors are made by one company in Italy. Here in the UK a number of 'Brands' for washing machine and various other appliances are actually all made by the same company but sold at different 'Price Points'.
    In another instance I was shopping for a laptop many years ago in a well known UK electrical retailer I asked how a particular laptop would compare with a laptop at another well known UK retailer. The salesman said to me that - "The corporation that owns us owns them as well and you will find that none of the models they sell have the same mix of specifications that the ones we sell have precisely so that you can't compare them and their prices" He then pointed me at what he thought was one of the best laptops they stocked for my needs as I'm not a gamer and have long since given up being a professional computer user. It was just up from the cheapest end of the range and it still works over 12 years later although I don't use it anymore except in emergencies..

    I think that business isn't doing too badly in the West....yet, but business doesn't have flags on the whole unless they are ones with dollar/pound/Yuan/Yen/Euro symbols in the corners and doesn't care where the goods are made and by whom as long as it has the right balance of cost and quality.

    But hey, we are musicians, we are supposed to be aloof from concerns of business and world trade :)
     
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  13. Henry

    Henry Gretschified

    Apr 9, 2014
    Petaluma
    The irony of course is that Gretsch used to manufacture for other labels. It is quite common now to separate ownership of IP, sales, production, etc. in complex industries as allowing each component to specialize in that area and have economies or scale results in better products and better prices (or better profit margins).
     
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  14. audept

    audept Senior Gretsch-Talker

    Age:
    71
    Dec 1, 2010
    Sydney, Australia
    Please pass on my regards, Rich. Tell him I miss his great contributions and his acid wit.
     
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  15. Yukimajo

    Yukimajo Electromatic

    Age:
    48
    65
    Nov 4, 2018
    Exeter UK
    Well it would be rude not to have a go! I think it's from Neal Stephenson’s novel Snow Crash (1992)
     
  16. El Marin

    El Marin Electromatic

    56
    Oct 4, 2018
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    I am looking for one of those counterfeits.

    I want a Fake Gibson Switchmaster or L5 or ES-295 or whatever like that. Will add some "no cool" stickers and heavy relic it and use in a punkrock band to beat it in bars and pubs and throw it to the public and to the drummer and treat it bad, really bad, even put fire on it some times... open air gigs

    I wouldn't do that with a real thing
     
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  17. Roger49

    Roger49 Country Gent

    Feb 18, 2015
    Germany
    Why not?
    Pete Townshend always did!
    I remember him in interview in the 60s in reply to his habit of smashing guitars saying:
    "It's not a Stradivarius we're talking about, just another mass-produced guitar off a production line".
    Interesting that we now consider many if not most of the quality guitars from that period that he was playing and smashing (Strats, Rickies, SGs etc.) as somehow better than what's made today!
     
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  18. Alberta_Slim

    Alberta_Slim Gretschie

    195
    May 18, 2018
    Ontario
    We have a winner! If anyone into sci-fi hasn't read this BTW, they should. It's fun, witty, surprising, and foresaw the invention of virtual reality and the public Internet.

    Please Yukimajo, choose from prize #1 (Setzer decal set) or prize #2 (JB Picks 2mm SB). You can send me shipping details in a Conversation. :)

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  19. loudnlousy

    loudnlousy Friend of Fred

    Age:
    53
    Oct 18, 2015
    Hildesheim, Germany
    Wow. Did not know that DrumBob writes articles. Interesting read. Thank you for sharing it.
     
  20. El Marin

    El Marin Electromatic

    56
    Oct 4, 2018
    Madrid, Spain, EU
    If I were a rich man... smashing switchmasters :confused:
     
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