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Discussion in 'Fred's Barcalounge' started by Poeticas, Jul 13, 2019.
I'm ok with the dead. It's the living that scare me.
I know there are seemingly unexplainable things I have experienced in my life, but generally I simply don’t try to explain them. If I need to, I use Ockham’s Razor - the correct answer is usually the simplest, the one that requires the fewest deviation from other things that have better proof. Most importantly is to keep an open mind, to acknowledge I can’t know everything, and things can change as I live more.
There may also be a scientific development that reveal the pink elephant that hides behond the moon too. But, just like ghosts, there’s absolutely no reason to think they will.
Yes I agree
I do like to think that almost anything is possible.
Then obviously some things are more likely than others.
Some things are so unlikely they fade into the "so unlikely it doesn't matter" category
So you've never seen "something", never experienced "something" you couldn't explain with logic, but insist on ridiculing the notion there could be "something". What does science say about that?
I find it amusing that when something cannot be explained it is called faith. When science can't explain it, it is called an anomaly....
Exactly, although I would argue that an anomaly is a phenomenon that deviates from the standard or expected, but not necessarily unexplained.
We humans in our egotism sometimes assume that if we don't know it, it is unknowable. Millenia of progress has proven that wrong. All we can say is whether something has been scientifically explained or not. To say something is unexplainable or cannot be understood would require omniscience, which would then contradict the conjecture that it is unknowable, since unknowability and omniscience cannot co-exist.
When we attribute phenomenon to spiritual type explanations, we are saying "I don't know, therefore I believe."
I would put ghosts under "known unknowns".
I took some time to contemplate and really sit back and think "should I / shouldn't I"....
Just the facts, (i.e. Sgt. Joe Friday - Dragnet)
I am 58, the "baby" of the family, the only boy, and the spoiled brat. I have 4 older sisters. We all grew up in upstate New York, a little east of Poughkeepsie, right near the Taconic State Pkwy & Route 55. My dad was a senior electronics engineer with IBM, retiring in 1977 after 30 years (he started at IBM after he came home and settled down after WWII).
In the mid 60's & 70's, we moved to a massive farmhouse on 25 acres (which can still be seen from the Taconic Pkwy, travelling northbound - just look over to your right). Each one of us kids had our own room, and there were rooms to spare too. Think of the TV show "The Waltons" but yet in upstate New York and in modern times, well 60's & 70's classic rock and "hippie" times. Truth: Max Yazgur's Farm (i.e. the site of Woodstock 1969) was actually about 1 hour away up Route 17 from my childhood home!
Anyway... It was a huge place, and had a lot of mystery to it and unanswered questions. It was a 200 year old farm house, after all. Legend has it that there was a trap door in the floor in my dad's workshop, that led to a rock staircase and into a dirt room. I was too little and feared getting an a$$ whoopin' so I never tried to see it. My older sisters snuck in there and pushed the big file cabinets and out of the way (covering it up), but were too chicken to pry open the trap door. We all learned later that it was used for the Underground Railroad!
Getting on the topic of ghosts... Whenever you walked from the den to the living room (or, basically, we had two living rooms, as the house was so huge), you would walk through a short hallway with the staircase leading upstairs. Anytime any of us walked through there, no matter what day, no matter what hour, we'd always smell pipe tobacco, like someone was smoking a pipe. My dad didn't smoke a pipe and nobody else in the family did either. But yet, you smelled it! Spooky....
Now for the good part - save the best for last... Whenever you went in the tiny hallway in between the 1st living room and the dining room, you would go up the main stairs, up to the bathroom, my parents bedroom, my sister Linda's room, my room, etc... When you got to the stop of the stairs and took a few steps in the big hallway, you could quickly look over your right shoulder into my parents bedroom.
IT ONLY HAPPENS ONCE --- Pffffftttt... THAT'S IT - IT'S GONE
A very quick look into my parents bedroom, and you will see a little girl standing on a stool wearing a very long black & white dress (her mom's?), and she is playing with her mom's pillbox hat with veil. She doesn't say "Boo" or anything like that. She doesn't look at you or see you. But you see her!
All these decades later... None of us kids ever mentioned it to anyone at all, for fear of being thrown in an institution. My parents never mentioned it either. We all just assumed we imagined it and that was that for all these years.
It wasn't until recently a number of years ago after my dad passed away and we all got together again during all the funeral proceedings and burial, etc... and one of the sisters happened to mention it. All 5 of us kids totally freaked out like you wouldn't believe! Other sisters started crying and hugging each other, as all those crazy childhood memories of ghosts came true as adults. I will never forget it...
GHOSTS ARE REAL!!!
And now you understand my position on this topic.
For the most part no, but even if I were to see something I don’t understand, I don’t jump to the conclusion that I’ve just witnessed otherworldly beings. I would think I’m missing either an important piece of information or lack the knowledge to fully understand what I just saw. But again, I don’t jump to “OMG, ghosts”.
That’s not what an anomaly is.
Actually, you know what, I do have a story from when I was a kid.
My parents took us to the place my mom grew up. Town is far too big a word to describe the place. It’s the kind of place where owning 100 acres is the norm, and you might have to walk an hour to the closest neighbour. For this trip, my folks decided we would stay in the house my mom grew up in. My grandparents had sold it a few years before to some wealthy Germans, but they had never come to town that anyone knew. But, that also meant the old farmhouse was empty, and had been for years. Wasn’t in great shape before that either.
So we showed up, and drove up the long, overgrown driveway to the old house, and set up camp. We had sleeping bags and air mattresses.
Not long after dark, the sounds began. First the scratching and scuffling. Then the low, terrifying moans. They lasted maybe a half hour. Young me was terrified, my father was weirded out, but my mother was convinced it was the ghost of her grandmother. After the half hour, the sounds stopped.
As we settled in for the second night, we had pretty much put the night before out of our minds. But when the sun went down this time, the sounds came back. Ten fold. The scraping. The moaning like a banshee. Floor boards in the old house began to bang and clatter.
No sleep was had that night. We huddled by candlelight, and waited for the sun to save us.
The next morning, my parents decided we would have to leave. We went to my aunt’s house down the road for breakfast, my exhausted parents telling the terror of the night before.
My aunt looked at my cousin, an unreadable look on her face. After a moment, she said, “David, didn’t I tell you to shoot those bloody groundhog sliving under the house before they got here. Damned things are in heat this time of year and make the worst noises.”
I lived in an honest to God haunted house for almost 5 years. Crazy stuff happened almost daily.
This has been an interesting topic.To answer the original question,"Do you believe in ghosts?" My answer is no. Are there any examples where the supernatural has been proven as fact or the paranormal scientific? No.
Surely,at this stage of our human enlightenment, we are beyond putting any seriousness towards ghosts/witches/horoscopes etc.
Dont be dismissive.But demand evidence.
Exactly and ghosts would be the last thing I'd think of
I'd just accept there would be a very logical scientific explanation for whatever it was that seemed weird and ....
I have little doubt I'd find it
And no I've never seen ghosts, anything supernatural, or anything else I couldn't easily explain with logic.
Plus, lets face it - Ghosts are pretty boring - I mean ... what do they do - just hang around and make weird noises.
Haven't they got something better to do than bother people trying to survive on this hostile planet
Bad ESP research? Were they looking at Dr. Venkman?
hahaha love it
Yeah there's many 1000s of examples around of dodgy alleged science and, if you go back in history, some classic episodes of elaborate masquerades that were successful in fooling people for decades.
There's been many books written about them.
There's many of examples of non science around today also ranging from "intelligent design" to multiple alleged medicines and everything published by the climate change denial industry. There's billions of $$ to be made from non science
Well that was pretty good satire.
It was confabulated with Stanley Milgram's research which I respect very much, but was somewhat hard on the subjects (none of which were shocked).
Ya’ know . . . from Pixels . . .
The ONLY way to take down PacMan is with ghosts . . .
Pixels Trailer (2013)
Seriously, I’ve had lots of weird things happen to me in my life and I was a total sceptic and always found a reason not to believe until it happened to me. There is something else going on out there, without a doubt. It took about 6 months of weird unexplainable stuff happening to me and another 4 years before I got uncomfortable enough to move. It was more about my kids than me. I was seriously worried for their safety. I don’t talk about it EVER but I think I can here. I’ll add details later if you guys want but I’m on my phone and it’s not a short story.