Anyone try the new solid state twins or deluxe reverbs?

Discussion in 'Ampage Area' started by freddyfingers, Sep 15, 2019.

  1. ruger9

    ruger9 Country Gent

    Nov 1, 2008
    NJ
    The stock amp is designed to, it's tweed in tonality. If CLEAN is what you after, you needed one of the Tone Capsules (the one I have is a Super Reverb on the clean channel). As far a loud, it'll be interesting... but I've never had a need to go above the 45W setting on the Roland. I'm sure the Bad Cat will be loud, and sound great. And to be honest, it's only 50% more in cost. But the Roland is a channel-switcher (great for the cover band), lighter, and no tubes to worry about. I love tube amps, but the next generation is here....

    And if the BC has more of that chest-thumping low end big iron, I will be 100% honest and admit it. However- unless you are SRV playing hella-loud in a trio, you don't need that kind of low end. In a 2-guitar rock band, it's all about the mids, and not stepping on the bass player...
     
    Robbie likes this.
  2. MrAstro

    MrAstro Gretschie

    430
    Mar 5, 2015
    Sydney, NSW
    I was reading something at some point about people putting out amps that have transistor circuits that mimic the original tube circuit layouts - I'm not technical enough to understand how. Obviously Tubes don't have three pins like a transistor. So somehow they supposedly mimic the tubes really well and are fairly true to the valve circuit designs - so they must have mimicked the valve pin outs somehow.
     
  3. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    No I never agreed with you when you said modeling amps are the future. I personally think that some other, better technology will come along and replace modeling.
    Anyway good luck with the gig - I'd show up if Ga. wasn't so far away....:).
     
    Waxhead likes this.
  4. blueruins

    blueruins Country Gent

    May 28, 2013
    Savannah, GA
    One thing about this line has me intrigued. A lot of modeling amps seem to sound like an amp that’s been played through a cabinet and recorded with a microphone. The tones are supposed to model a studio recording of that amp.
    These Fender’s are meant to react just like a regular amp.
    I tried the Helix stuff and I thought it sounded great running through the effects loop of a tube amp with all the cab and mic sims off.
    Otherwise, I don’t care for that feeling of playing a guitar through studio monitors though.
    For my situation, I can’t see any good reason to buy one of these amps, but I think it will be cool if they finally do match the hype.
     
  5. ruger9

    ruger9 Country Gent

    Nov 1, 2008
    NJ
    YES! That has been my experience with modelers as well, and it's why I love the Roland Blues Cube... it's an AMP, not a modeler. Now- the Fenders ARE "modeling", because they are digital apparently... everyone who's played one seems seriously impressed not only with how much they sound like the amps they are modeling, but even more importantly how they sound and feel like a real amp... the Roland certainly does! I think we have arrived... Fender is now getting on the bandwagon. And the tech will continue to improve.

    And for anyone who has the "I want a handwired amp ONLY" dogma, this is an interesting read:
    https://www.premierguitar.com/artic...-handwired-amps-superior-to-pcb-based-designs

    (altho I'll admit... even *I* would prefer HW, but not for tone- but for the ability to possibly troubleshoot and repair it myself. Other than that, the HW is just adding weight.)
     
    blueruins, Ricochet and Robbie like this.
  6. Ricochet

    Ricochet I Bleed Orange

    Nov 13, 2009
    Monkey Island
    That's the only good argument to bring up. Also, I don't like how budget amps tend to have the tubes mounted on the PCB. On the other hand. My 45 yo beat to s... Marquis Plexi clone has this and is still going strong... so who knows.

    To quote a well known amp designer. "If you're in a spaceship would you rather have the wiring soldered PTP or a PCB?"
     
    blueruins and ruger9 like this.
  7. ruger9

    ruger9 Country Gent

    Nov 1, 2008
    NJ
    Well, if I'm carrying that spaceship up to a 2nd floor stage....lol
     
    Ricochet likes this.
  8. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    I read the Premier guitar article which is an opinion piece of pcb amps vs hand wired. He said some of the best amps have pcb in them but he never names the amps he's talking about. All I know is putting tube sockets on the pcb is a bad idea. Too much heat that will eventually cause failure. When you have to repair an amp with pots on the pcb you have to totally dis-assemble the whole thing just to replace a pot. Instead of replacing a pot taking 20 minutes it winds up taking 3 times as much. Finding a cracked solder joint on a pcb can take lots of time compared to hand wired where you can move wires and locate the problem much quicker. I'm not saying that pcb amps sound bad but the reissues like Fender do sound different than their hand wired counterparts. Distances between components are different. Going through different length & gauge wire will change the sound too. The sum of all parts and changes in layout is what causes tonal differences.
    That said all my Marshall amps have pcb boards. The older ones with hand wired controls are much better than the newer ones that have everything on the main board - tubes, pots, etc. The older ones are easier to work on and have had less problems. A tube failure on an amp that has the tubes on the pcb can cause burn through on the pcb that can require the whole board to be replaced. That doesn't happen with hand wired amps.
     
    MotorCentaur likes this.
  9. Waxhead

    Waxhead Country Gent

    Aug 30, 2014
    Australia
    Completely agree again.
    And it's becoming more of an issue every year as young people are brought up with mp3s and youtube. They become so accustomed to it they actually prefer it to a hifi stereo playing vinyl or CDs.

    Same with modelling amps if that's all you ever play or own.
    I've seen threads on the Mesa Boogie board of young guys who just bought a $3000 Mark V or Lonestar and complaining it won't do a tone from a really bad lofi youtube video.

    But then older guys do go to concerts where bands are playing high quality tube amps so surely they can tell the difference :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
    Gretschtim1 likes this.
  10. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    Depends on if I have another pcb to plug in or not. If it fried and melted I better have a replacement. If not I'd rather have ptp and some extra wire and replacement components...:D.
     
    Ricochet likes this.
  11. TSims1

    TSims1 Gretschified

    Jun 18, 2013
    Atlanta
    I think the diehards hang their hat on their traditions, and that’s fine. I get it. But the truth of the matter is we live in an amazing time to be a guitar player with LOTS of options to accomplish whatever you want to accomplish. I personally celebrate and implement ALL of it. I’m inspired by the sounds of yesterday AND tomorrow. Art breathes and is ever-evolving. That’s the BEAUTY of this stuff.......it doesn’t stay the same. And I’m grateful for it. Bring on the Fender models of its own doggone amps! It’s ironic and awesome!
     
    ronbo, Robbie, calebaaron666 and 2 others like this.
  12. Gretschmen65

    Gretschmen65 Synchromatic

    606
    May 20, 2016
    Australia
    [QUOTE="Ricochet, post: 1204942, member:

    To quote a well known amp designer. "If you're in a spaceship would you rather have the wiring soldered PTP or a PCB?"[/QUOTE]

    Well that's a typical amp builders argument.

    It would be PCB. If it were PTP the spaceship would have been so big and heavy it would still be on earth.

    I believe much of the hype and negative information about SS, digital and modeling is generated by the backyard, boutique builders who can cope with the 70 year old technology but could never afford the R&D to move forward.

    It costs enormous amounts of $$$ to research and develop the technology which enables production of the digitally modelled amps of the future.
    Only big corporations can afford to do it.

    Roland are there with their Blues Cube line and thankfully Fender look like they are serious about meeting the challenge.

    Bring on the light weight versions of those dinosauric things that ran on tubes needing regular costly replacement, re-biasing and gentle handling.

    Yes, and leave the back breaking technology to the boutique builder. My guess is their days are numbered.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
    Robbie, new6659 and Ricochet like this.
  13. Henry

    Henry Gretschified

    Apr 9, 2014
    Petaluma
    The best part of the article is where the admit people mostly hear what the want or expect to hear, damn reality. All that extra wire for point to point, might need a buffer ;)
     
    ruger9 likes this.
  14. Gretschtim1

    Gretschtim1 Country Gent

    Dec 4, 2012
    Dundalk, Md
    Maybe I was just lucky but in the 40+ years (I played between 100-200 shows most years) I only had 1 power tube fail on me, a diode went bad on my 63 Bandmaster and a power tube on my Marshall 800 failed and blew a fuse. We traveled all over the US playing gigs, tons of recording sessions and no major failures on any of my tube equipment. My transistor stuff on the other hand always gave me problems. Power transistors failing and taking out 6 or 7 12 inch speakers. Amps over heating and shutting down.
    Tube amps get a bad rap mostly because people didn't and don't know how to take care of them. My 65 Ampeg Gemini I still has the original power tubes and that amp's been played up to 8 hours a day for years. My 65 AC 30 ran for years on the same power tubes. I did replace filter caps on a few amps and repaired a weak tremolo in the ampeg but that's it. Fixing vintage amps is a lot easier than fixing any of the modern stuff. 60 years later you can still get parts for most of these amps. I don't think you're gonna be able to say that about any of these new modeling amps because just like computers and consumer digital mixing consoles they will become obsolete in 5 or 10 years and parts will not be available for them anymore. So if you think repairing a tube amp is costly wait till Kemper amps start blowing up and see how cheap it is to fix them...:eek:.
     
  15. radd

    radd Country Gent

    Dec 27, 2017
    Santa cruz
    I have the Blues Cube Stage, and Fender Princeton Reverb 65, love them both.

    The Cube cost close to what the new Fenders cost. If those Fenders were around when I researched and bought the Cube I would have seriously considered them.
     
  16. T Bone

    T Bone Country Gent

    Friend of mine just ordered the Twin today. Should be here in a few days, hope to have a good report by next weekend.
     
  17. Finally a thread related reply. Can’t wait to hear!
     
    T Bone, calebaaron666 and TSims1 like this.
  18. S.R.Cash

    S.R.Cash Gretschie

    107
    Aug 29, 2019
    Ontario, Canada
    I'm just glad I play squeaky clean with some slapback. Most amp arguments quickly become irrelevant that way. If I was going for this kind of amp, I'm all in for SS. Since getting my Blues Cube Hot, I see no reason to over look SS.
     
    wildeman likes this.
  19. wildeman

    wildeman Gretschified

    May 10, 2015
    norcal
    My mind is very open. I love Roland amps and am very interested in trying a new Cube, mine are all old. I don't like being dependant on some communist supply of tubes that can be cut off in an instant, just my view of it. I think new tubes are crap compared to old one's anyway (in my experience). I'm all for SS amps and have no problem payin up for a nice one.
    I do have some choice old tube amps too but i really don't even think about it when i grab an amp out of my closet, its just what one will do the job at hand.
     
    calebaaron666 likes this.
  20. calebaaron666

    calebaaron666 Country Gent

    Aug 15, 2018
    Portland, Maine
    The demos of these puppies that I’ve listened to online have sounded pretty dope.
    I’d play thru the tonemaster deluxe. Why not? It’ll sound like my sleazy fingers regardless of what I’m playing thru!
     
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