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Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 11:59 AM

This is an old and major problem I've never mentioned before. In my 1997 Gretsch 6120 Nashville the old ceramic Filtertrons are not centered, probably, because of the sloppy work of that Gretsch factory worker. He probably had a bad day, his girlfriend has left him, he was drunk, or his favorite reality show guy was voted out last night…. or he was just simply not qualified enough. (In Japan???….)

Now I am waiting for me new TV Classics. What do you guys recommend to me to get it fixed? (The Gibsron ABR-1 bridge is in the prefect place. My tech guy is the best luthier in Budapest, Hungary.)

I attached few pictures:

Dan C · May 21st, 2012, 12:32 PM

Its not that your pickup is not centred, it's that the pole pieces on any Filtertron other than TVJs don't space the poles correctly on the bridge Pup

Mine line up on the Neck Pup and the bridge Pup is slightly off - doesn't bother me too much because I have set the bridge so that the D & G match helping to minimise the gap on other strings...

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan C

Its not that your pickup is not centred, it's that the pole pieces on any Filtertron other than TVJs don't space the poles correctly on the bridge Pup

Mine line up on the Neck Pup and the bridge Pup is slightly off - doesn't bother me too much because I have set the bridge so that the D & G match helping to minimise the gap on other strings...

Yes but the pickup is centered (almost) in the space was carved for them... How to shift if when the correctly spaced TVs are getting installed?

Dan C · May 21st, 2012, 12:42 PM

Is your problem with where the pick-up is in the body or where the strings rest over the pole pieces? The TV's will sort the pole pieces problem out, and then you will really be able to see how off it really is

Personally I doubt that it is off centre (if any) to make enough difference for you to hear it. I could be wrong though!

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 01:16 PM

Yes, but you can see the holes of the pickup ring. They re clearly off.

Anakin2Solo · May 21st, 2012, 01:43 PM

You could always plug those holes with wood and drill new ones. It looks like it is the holes that are off, not the routing for the pickup. I am sure you will be able to get the TV Classics in there correctly. I look forward to seeing your results.

Uncle Daddy · May 21st, 2012, 02:11 PM

What about a space control bridge?

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Daddy

What about a space control bridge?

Thank you for the advice but since I ve got the ABR-1 installed I figured that It's not the bridge... The strings are perfectly set to the middle of the fingerboard. The pickup is off..

6stings · May 21st, 2012, 02:29 PM

Servus Pete, your problem is the FilterTron spacing!
They make the same spacing on bridge and neck Filters, close to 48.5 mm.

The space control bridge will help.

Or, you can replace the bridge pickup with TV Jones Classic, he makes his bridge pickups with 51.5 mm spacing.

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 6stings

Servus Pete, your problem is the FilterTron spacing!
They make the same spacing on bridge and neck Filters, close to 48.5 mm.

The space control bridge will help.

Or, you can replace the bridge pickup with TV Jones Classic, he makes his bridge pickups with 51.5 mm spacing.

Helli! Yes, youre right about it. Last week I ordered a set of TV Classisc

TV the Wired Turtle · May 21st, 2012, 02:51 PM

Pete, rest assured that the pole screws on the tvjones classic bridge are spaced string to string correctly and the pickup body is taller and closer to the strings (the tech needs to fully understand tom jones specs of setting filtertrons 3/16" from top of pickup covers to bottom of both E strings)..

regarding the pickup route not being squared up on the guitar, even if you put the TVjones in and the strings are all coming across the pole screws a bit off centered, its not to hard to grind the "ears" of the pickup slightly shorter which will give you lateral movement to drill new mount screw holes for lining things up... BUT one thing you must consider with that era gretsch you have.. the entire bigsby may not be centered on the guitar. this was the case with my 99' SSU and I had to remount my bigsby so there was a straight string pull from the nut to the bridge, as this will also help in stable tuning and slightly more sustain with reduced ghost noting.

again I have to beg you to help the guitar tech understand that he will need to put fresh neoprene/compressed rubber shims under the pickups so that they can meet the height specs that tvjones stipulates.. these pickups do not sound good unless they are set up correctly and for some strange reason... gretsch does not bother to take care of this. irks the hell out of me so I always preach the pickup height issue.

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TV the Wired Turtle

...
... BUT one thing you must consider with that era gretsch you have.. the entire bigsby may not be centered on the guitar...

Yes, you are absolutely right, my Bigsby is not centered, is off about 3mm-s.
Last time, about 2 monts ago, when I had my guitar refretted, the luthier asked me about re drilling the Bigsby, but finally we discussed not to do it, because we have the bridge on place with double sided tape, so the strings are on the prefect position, middle of the neck, having the same space on both edges of the fretboard. So in this case the relocation of the Bigsby wouldn't have helped to have the strings right in the centre. Because of the tape my bridge is not flexible anymore (I can remove it, but after that I need new tape), so there was no reasons to drill new holes.

Actually I have no idea why they built these guitars so sloppy. No centered pickups, bigsby etc.

But here you can see that the strings and the bridge are on the perfect spot.

I took your advice and I already talk to the luthier/tech person, and we decided to have a detailed conversation about every details, before he starts to replace the pickup. Including the compressed rubber, poles, new mounting holes, heights etc.
I even find a video where TV Jones installs this rubber, using a new mouse pad.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iS2-5QtYGuk

I don't know how to thank you for all the advices!

cowmoo · May 21st, 2012, 03:26 PM

Tavo, i've just received a set of TV classics to drop in my old Anni, they were 2nd hand but came with a small bag with some grey rubber in, i assume this is for shimming.
Should both p'ups be 3/16" from strings, as to me that seems awful close as the poles must be 1/8" themselves.
I usually, for some reason i've forgotten, turn the poles to diagonally oppose each other too.

I have the same problem on the anni with the p'up spacing being too narrow at the bridge, but it doesn't seem to present any noticeable fluctuation in volume across the strings and the Tv's are ready to go in anyhow.

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 03:26 PM

But I still don't understand the reasons of all of the imperfections on these guitars...
When I purchased this in 1998 it cost 4700 Deutch Marks, (today about 4000 EUR), more than my annual income... I was just hired as a lead guitarist for a 18 stations tour for a big Hungarian swing musician's orchestra, and I have saved all the money. I travelled 2000 kms to Köln, Germany, to buy the only available one I could find in Europe with limited internet access...
So how come that they made such a mistakes and imperfections on that extremely expensive guitar? Japanese quality normally better than this...

Uncle Daddy · May 21st, 2012, 03:37 PM

It's these minor imperfections that partly make these great guitars what they are! If they were perfect, they'd have no "character". Hondas and BSA's, Chevvy or Civic, there are plenty of folk around who perversely seem to dig troublesome objects.

Gretsch or Yamaha...no choice really (but each to their own, of course).

Just to add a little spice here, my 5120 has NO manufacturing faults, which is probably why Fender put lower quality pickups on, to give us something to beef about!

Pete Gorilla · May 21st, 2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Daddy

It's these minor imperfections that partly make these great guitars what they are! If they were perfect, they'd have no "character".

It's a really good phrase. Yes, thats why there are no other guitars same as mine or yours.

stevo · May 21st, 2012, 03:45 PM

This is an interesting issue. But the real question is - does it make a difference in the sound? I'm heading home this afternoon to see how mine looks!

montereyjack66 · May 21st, 2012, 08:47 PM

To me, that's the ticket. What does it sound like at the other end of the hall?

mj

Pete Gorilla · May 22nd, 2012, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by montereyjack66

To me, that's the ticket. What does it sound like at the other end of the hall?

mj

So far it sounds good

Billy C · May 22nd, 2012, 03:02 AM

Pete, I know what you are going through. My 2006 T/Rose had the same basic problems with bigsby out of line, etc. I bought it new and didn't really look closely at the poles, position of bigsby and string alignment. Mine has filtrons. It was still under warranty so Fender paided to have everything squared up. Had to drill new holes to reposition the bigsby and the old holes were filled and the plate covered them, nothing showed. In Japan they must have had a bad day when they put mine together. I would definitely consider squaring up the bigsby as that puts different pressures on the first string and sixth string.. If you get a nice clear sound on them and you are happy, then that is all that matters. Oh, I paided $1, 800.00 (usa) for mine in 06. No one has ever told me what the effect is if the strings are out of line with the poles and to what degree the range of magnetic field is influenced by pole height to the string bottom and off or dead centered on the pole. Good luck on your 6120 Nashville update. Hopefully I'll see on Gretsch Talk how you made out...................