[Bionic Muffins]

when i first let it rip it was pretty much perfect after a few little tweaks.

but i moved it since then!

so started marking the setting that works best for me so far. this may be of interest to other space echo users and if nothing else i will put this down for posterity:

RE-150, using the "o'clocks"
instrument level 1:30
repeat rate 9
intensity 11
echo volume 12:30

mode 1
output -35


the reason i like it is because not only does it just plain sound FAT and smooth but it kind of creates layers in the tone...it allows me a clean clangy top end and a low end full of grit and "analog soup" as i have heard it called.

into a silverface bassman with country gent.

typical bassman setting: dial number; both vols 4 (subject to change depending on room), treb 10, mid 10, bass 4. middle chan input 1, bright switch on.


anybody else?

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Originally Posted by Bionic Muffins

when i first let it rip it was pretty much perfect after a few little tweaks.

but i moved it since then!

so started marking the setting that works best for me so far. this may be of interest to other space echo users and if nothing else i will put this down for posterity:

RE-150, using the "o'clocks"
instrument level 1:30
repeat rate 9
intensity 11
echo volume 12:30

mode 1
output -35


the reason i like it is because not only does it just plain sound FAT and smooth but it kind of creates layers in the tone...it allows me a clean clangy top end and a low end full of grit and "analog soup" as i have heard it called.

into a silverface bassman with country gent.

typical bassman setting: dial number; both vols 4 (subject to change depending on room), treb 10, mid 10, bass 4. middle chan input 1, bright switch on.


anybody else?

gotta use a +30ft guitar cable for the impedance to start matching the guitar's pickups or it'll never sound clear as it should or does with a line level instrument like a keyboard.

on my RE301
(using the "o'clocks")
instrument level 4
input -35db

output -25

congrats on gettin a nice tape echo.. if you are interested Billy Zoom has a mod for putting a Jfet at the input of the space echo to alleviate the need for the long cable.. 201 owners swear by it. Just a simple little Jfet added.

[Bionic Muffins]

well, since i cant run the bassman on ten like i would like to get a gritty sound im trying to get grit out of the space echo because the grit on it sounds good! so far this is as close as i have gotten which is pretty darn.

any other ideas?

[TV the Wired Turtle]

You need to run into the bassmans normal channel with the bass down at 1 (the space echo has a fat low mids) and the treble up at 6, presence (or bright switch on) at 8-10.

The tough part for the RE-150 is that it doesnt have a lot of headroom in the lows when turned up due to the transistors it uses ( re-301 has big headroom and runs on Opamps)
so when you crank the input gain up, it will make the bassman overdrive but the lows get flabby. Try putting two guitar cables coupled together so that you are putting 30ft. or more of guitar cable between the guitar and the space echo.. this will increase the high end and gain structure as the impedance of the guitar and the space echo are better matched. All this of course is predicated on gretsch filtertrons pickups or pickups not exceeding 6K dc resistance.. all saying any filtertrons up to that point when used with that extended cable length will strangely but effectively behave as mentioned. This is the VERY reason Setzer gets the sound he does with the space echo.

[Bionic Muffins]

Cool, thanks tv. I have a selection of 30footers on hand. I will give it a go and report back.

[Bionic Muffins]

got another question for you TV. in order to get the grind at more reasonable volumes how high should i run the input and where should i set the output selector?

on the bassman at that point should i leave the vols around 4?

[Bionic Muffins]

i used the 30 footer today, and it definately helped getting gain out of the space echo. but, it sucked my highs...as to be expected, but im a treble whore. i have two other 30 footers i will try tomorrow. the one today was one of those typical live wire elites. for 30 footers i also have a bullet, a planet waves custom, and a a slightly shorter (21) foot fatsoflex.

will experiment, on the right path though. 85% there.

[TV the Wired Turtle]

its sucked your highs? that should not happen with filtertrons.. you were using a gretsch with filtertrons right? and did you adjust the bassman with the bright switch on and treble at 7 with bass down at 1-2?

[Bionic Muffins]

Originally Posted by TV the Wired Turtle

its sucked your highs? that should not happen with filtertrons.. you were using a gretsch with filtertrons right? and did you adjust the bassman with the bright switch on and treble at 7 with bass down at 1-2?

country gent with filtertrons

birght switch on...treb up to ten at one point bass was kept less than three. mids off.

maybe the tape is too old? would that have an effect?

granted it was a cheaper cable. and like i said i am a treble whore. it sounded great and warm but just a little bit blanketed compared to my 18 foot fatsoflex.

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Originally Posted by Bionic Muffins

country gent with filtertrons

birght switch on...treb up to ten at one point bass was kept less than three. mids off.

maybe the tape is too old? would that have an effect?

granted it was a cheaper cable. and like i said i am a treble whore. it sounded great and warm but just a little bit blanketed compared to my 18 foot fatsoflex.

Re-150 ...hmmmm I gotta find the schematic and see if its the same as the others. See what you get with 50ft (guitar volume all the way up unless you have a treble bleed cap)

the tape could be completely missing and it wouldnt matter as the preamp is its own thing in that box of fun.

[Bionic Muffins]

im going to try the 21 foot fatsoflex here in a little bit to see if its a good "happy-medium" for retaining highs and getting grind.


thanks for everything TV. you are a national treasure.

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Originally Posted by Bionic Muffins

im going to try the 21 foot fatsoflex here in a little bit to see if its a good "happy-medium" for retaining highs and getting grind.


thanks for everything TV. you are a national treasure.

nnooooo.. just insane. I wont tell you what happens in a room when
you plug a nocturne brain preamp into a space echo. I had black ops helicopters flying over my house and I swore I saw a DeLorean fly past the front yard on fire.

[Bionic Muffins]

wat? 21 foot fatso no good?

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Originally Posted by Bionic Muffins

wat? 21 foot fatso no good?

I think you might be confusing "Capacitance loading" with Impedance matching.

Just because you pop in say an uber expensive Klotch cable with super low
capacitance loading isnt going to make your hi end more clear in this situation

because an impedance mismatch is taking place between the impedance of the guitar pickups ( or microphones) and the space echo preamp impedance ( mic preamp) this is a resistance situation not capacitance.... Strangely these filtertrons of ours have a super low DC resistance of 4-6K and in order to get the Space echo to match the rule of having say 10X the impedance of these filtertrons.. it requires a SUPER long cable between them for this to work out correctly and you are not gonna get that working with 21 feet of anything called a guitar instrument cable. it needs to be in excess of 35feet. 50-100ft is what Setzer uses. The Canare cable he does use keeps excessively low capacitance loading with long runs but its the impedance thing that lets him get that crunchy twangy thing always happening between his guitar and blonde bassman.

(this is why it took me a year of tweaking my version of the re301s preamp before I could just plug a 12ft'er into it and over to the amp to get the same results)

amp on the left has the boat load of george L cabling into the RE301, the amp on the right has simple cabling running to the nocturne
(ignore the "sales" context of the video, it was back when I was trying to prove to the world I had a viable solution.. I dont even make the brain seltzer any more since figuring out how to make it work for all kinds of guitars and amps)

YouTube - ‪NOCTURNE BRAIN SELTZER...

[Bionic Muffins]

Well i tweaked aroubd some more and am about 10% closer to ideal. 21 foot fatso, input vol 1 oclock, rate, intensity, and echo vol all at 10 oclock, mode 3. Normal chan input #1, bright on treb 10 mid 2 bass 4 both chan and master vols at 3.

[TV the Wired Turtle]

the RE-150 is slightly different it seems and you should be in channel #3 not 1 or 2 as 3 is the instrument channel. 1 and 2 are supposedly for lo Z mic input and 3 is for hi Z instruments.

[Bionic Muffins]

And fwiw i remember seeing that th re150 preamp has diff components from the 201 and 301

[Bionic Muffins]

Oh yeah, important note i left out...the instrument in jack is non functional atm so im having to use the mic input

Suppsoe that will get me the rest of the way there?

[TV the Wired Turtle]

Originally Posted by Bionic Muffins

Oh yeah, important note i left out...the instrument in jack is non functional atm so im having to use the mic input

Suppsoe that will get me the rest of the way there?

Unless you have an external DI that will convert your guitar hi Z to lo Z
(most DI boxes have a transformer inside) you will not ever get this to work
for you properly.. you must fix channel 3.. Open it up and check the solder joints to channel 3. Take some circuit cleaner spray (like Deoxit) and a small
pipe cleaner and clean it up as well.. spray into the slot of the gain pot for that channel too.

Thats your ticket to ride

[Bionic Muffins]

Cool, will do.