[Handley]

The story goes like this...

I had a Strat. It was a killer Strat. Widely regarded as the best production line Strat available. If you wanted a better Strat you'd have to get a Custom Shop Strat. It was an Eric Johnson Signature Strat and it sounded goooooood and it played goooooood. But, something was missing.

I got a Gretsch 6120RHH. One year passed and, as I walked down the hall one day, something caught my eye under one of our couches. I decided to take a closer look and I realized it was a guitar case. Upon opening it I found an Eric Johnson Strat that hadn't been played for a year (10 months really... but a year sounds better). I decided that if I hadn't played the guitar for a year then I really didn't need it sitting around. Besides, it was meant to be played... just not by me anymore. So, I decided to sell it.

And now I have an Epiphone Elitist Casino to compliment the 6120 (with special thanks to Tricone). Sounds good and fits my playing style much better than the Strat. Now I just need the pickup shims to arrive so I can get it growling.

[JaygLongBeach]

Congrats!!! My elitist casino is the one I keep out on the stand cause it's such a perfect player,
Hope you enjoy yours just as much !

[nadles]

Congratulations. looks very tasty.

[NickGretsch]

Congratulations Handley, good move. That's one beautiful guitar you've bought.

I adore my Casino, it's a S/B "Inspired By", couldn't afford the Elitist but it's still an excellent version.

Am interested to know more about this shim business, never heard of that before. Could try the Gibson/Epi forum but they're a pretty dowdy lot in my experience unlike here at G-T which is brilliant.

So shims...anymore info would be helpful, thanks

[MatchlessMan]

Wow! Love P90s on a semi

[5120mantis]

i have a Casino from '99, one of the best sounding guitars i own... Especially with a Fender amp. in fact i'm using it to record the scratch tracks in the studio today.
Congrats, they age well.

[Gotone]

Congrats on an absolutely superb guitar. I have an Elitist Casino in natural..it still catches my breath every time I open the case and play it. Enjoy!

[Anne]

i side with Sir Paul on this issue , if you had to pick one guitar to be stranded on an island with ,,,,,,,, a Casino ,, and i own a lot of guitars , the Casino is just killer

[Handley]

Originally Posted by NickGretsch

Am interested to know more about this shim business, never heard of that before. Could try the Gibson/Epi forum but they're a pretty dowdy lot in my experience unlike here at G-T which is brilliant.

So shims...anymore info would be helpful, thanks

I've heard and read that one of the secrets to P90's is to get them as close to the strings as possible (without allowing the magnet to pull down the string and decrease sustain). I'm not all that experienced with P90's so I figured I'd try it out.

The shims (also called spacers) are made by Lindy Fralin and All Parts. The Dog Ear P90's aren't height adjustable, like the soap bar P90's, since they screw right into the top of the guitar. There are only two options to get them closer to the strings: unscrew the individual pole pieces or put something under the pickups to move them closer. Moving the pole pieces doesn't really seem like the best option to me since they're made for balancing the volume of individual strings and not the overall pup.

People shim the pup for two reasons. The bridge pickup is usually a bit quieter than the neck and raising the bridge pup helps even out the volume (yes, this can easily be fixed by turning the neck volume down a bit on the guitar). The other reason is that people want to get as much volume out of the P90's as possible creating a bit more grit (my main reason). Changing the pup height can change the tone as well. For me it's really a combination of both, plus, I really want to get to know the characteristics of this guitar and what P90's can offer.

Spacers and shims are made specifically for that purpose but I've also heard of people using popsicle sticks, washers, and foam rubber. Since the Lindy Fralin shims aren't that expensive and don't stick out as far as the All Parts spacers I figured I'd go with them. They should arrive tomorrow so I'll post a reply about how they impact the tone.

Here's some pics of the Lindy Fralin ones. They come in two sizes. Not sure if I'll use both or just put one under the bridge pup.

[JaygLongBeach]

Very interesting about the shims... I've always controlled the pickup difference with the volume knobs; so are you planning on adding a bigsby b7 next? I'm planning on it now after owning my casino for 5 years.

[NickGretsch]

Thanks a lot Handley, that's really informative.

Well one good thing,I don't seem to get the imbalance of pickup levels, they both seem matched.

If you can post follow up info with a photo or two that would be really interesting. Am pretty happy with the way mine sounds but am always keen to try something different.

Cheers

[NSM245]

Casinos are my favourite non-Gretsch guitars, I've had one for a few years and I love it - congrats on yours! - P90's are great btw

[Handley]

so...

I got the shims on Monday and have been spending some time messin' around with them and the guitar set up.

First I put on a new pair of strings (11's instead of the 10's that were on it) and adjusted the action, intonation, etc. The neck relief was right where I like it (almost perfectly straight).

With the new strings on and the action adjusted there wasn't enough room for the large shim so I started with the smaller one. It took a few tries to get it place just right because it is the exact same size and the pickup and doesn't stick out like the All Parts shim.

The small shim brought the two pickups back to a balanced volume and it sounds even better than before. I finally got to turn things up today and had a hard time putting it down.

From reading suggestions on both the Fralin and Lollard sites I still want to try out both pickups a bit closer. The bridge is still about 5/32's away from the strings so I think I'll pick up a couple of the smaller shims and see what happens when I stack them. That way I should be able to play with the distance.

To be continued...

[NickGretsch]

Cheers for the update

Those heavier strings are going to make a difference too. It's a shame that I can't contend with anything heavier than 10's

[JLD4133]

Originally Posted by NickGretsch

Cheers for the update

Those heavier strings are going to make a difference too. It's a shame that I can't contend with anything heavier than 10's

D'addario makes a set of 10 1/2's which is a nice compromise between 10's and 11's. Youi coudl try those. They are not readily available, but your music store can order them.

[fender62custom]

Greetings Handley..congrats on your purchase...enjoy!!!!

[PacRat]

Nice report . . . a Casinos on my wish list as well . . . maybe someday . . . Hmmmmm

[Handley]

When I got the first two shims I noticed one of them was made of plastic (the thick one) and the other (thin) looked suspiciously like the gasket I installed around the carb on my 1990 Wrangler a few years ago. So instead of shelling out the mere $5.99 for another shim and $6.99 for shipping I stopped by the auto parts store and spent $6.99 on two feet of gasket.

I used the larger plastic shim as a template and cut two shims out of the rubber fiber gasket material so I could swap things around and see what I liked best. The thin shim from Fralin seemed a bit more dense that the gasket I used so once they were cut out I covered each which superglue which hardened them up nicely. It also allowed me to sand off some of the sharp edges and bumps.

I ended up using the original thin shim on the neck pickup and stacked two of the homemade shims (glued them together) under the bridge. The bridge pickup is now about 3/32 away from the strings and only have to do minor adjustments to the pole pieces for individual string balance.

It has definitely changed the tone of the guitar. Much deeper, grittier, and higher output. In the past I always plugged in to the "Hi" input on my amp and the new setup added so much more drive to the sound I switched to the "Low" input (I didn't want to change my amp settings just yet). Some might describe the sound as a bit more "muddy", which is what happens when you move the pickups closer, but I'm not sure if it is just different than before or too muddy so I'm going to leave it like this for a while. I'd say the bridge pickup is now slightly louder than the neck.

Next project... Keep the selector switch from rattling.

[NickGretsch]

Originally Posted by JLD4133

D'addario makes a set of 10 1/2's which is a nice compromise between 10's and 11's. Youi coudl try those. They are not readily available, but your music store can order them.

Thanks for the suggestion, however already been there, done it. Wasn't too impressed. Was surprised what a difference there was between the two and I really didn't like those lighter ones.

Must add, this was on a Burny SG, not a Gretsch and not on my Epi IB Casino

[Handley]

Got rid of the pick guard too.

Neck shim: Fralin

Bridge shim: me

I definitely like these better than the All Parts shims because they don't stick out and change the look of the guitar.