In your opinion, which locking tuners are the best choice for my 5120?
I want the best, and the easiest to install. (myself)

In your opinion, which locking tuners are the best choice for my 5120?
I want the best, and the easiest to install. (myself)

well i would say sperzel locking tuners but you need to enlarge the tuner holes just a little bit, shouldnt be to hard

Keep in mind... the general consensus is that locking tuners only aid in the speed of restringing - they don’t really aid in keeping a guitar in tune. The way to keep in tune is to lube the nut, the bridge (lightly), and, if you have a Bigsby, lube on the Bigs tension bar (again, just a little).

Keep in mind... the general consensus is that locking tuners only aid in the speed of restringing - they don’t really aid in keeping a guitar in tune. The way to keep in tune is to lube the nut, the bridge (lightly), and, if you have a Bigsby, lube on the Bigs tension bar (again, just a little).

+100!

I have a set of Sperzels on my 5129. Installed em myself, wasn't too bad. I've been thrilled with them and plan to put them in every guitar I buy from here on out.

In your opinion, which locking tuners are the best choice for my 5120?
I want the best, and the easiest to install. (myself)

Planet Wave 3+3, of course ! Make sure the screw hole is in the " 6 o'clock " position.

I've seen them for $59.00 US on E-Bay.

Planet Wave 3+3, of course ! Make sure the screw hole is in the " 6 o'clock " position.

I've seen them for $59.00 US on E-Bay.

Planet Waves will fit right in....NO enlarging the hole required !!!:cool:

Crooner. I must disagree as there is a deeper logic behind locking tuners most people simply neglect for tradition.

Sure the bigger issue always lies @ the nut, but realistically when the nut is perfectly taken care of the instrument's string windings will settle faster and be more effective w/ locking tuners.

If you line the tuning post's string hole up so that you can pull the string straight through w/ zero wraping, Lock it, you can tune every string up and have under half a winding.

Less windings means less time for the strings to settle in and its easier to maintain a tuning stability that way. I HATE stretching out my windings around the tuning post, as it messes w/ the whole tuning of the instrument for at least 30 straight minutes.

I dont have locking tuners, because mine havn't broken yet to replace them, but when I buy new after these strip or what have you I think they're worth the investment.

Thank you guys.
The Planet Waves thing sounds great to me (not drilling)

Valuable opinions. I do appreciate it.

Crooner. I must disagree as there is a deeper logic behind locking tuners most people simply neglect for tradition.

Sure the bigger issue always lies @ the nut, but realistically when the nut is perfectly taken care of the instrument's string windings will settle faster and be more effective w/ locking tuners.

If you line the tuning post's string hole up so that you can pull the string straight through w/ zero wraping, Lock it, you can tune every string up and have under half a winding.

Less windings means less time for the strings to settle in and its easier to maintain a tuning stability that way. I HATE stretching out my windings around the tuning post, as it messes w/ the whole tuning of the instrument for at least 30 straight minutes.

I dont have locking tuners, because mine havn't broken yet to replace them, but when I buy new after these strip or what have you I think they're worth the investment.

You know what? I'm gonna have to concede to you on the point of less string windings. Having a couple of turns around the tuning peg does, indeed, necessitate extra stretching, but if done right strings will settle in fast, but this can be cut shorter with no windings and locking tuners. That being said, I still maintain that the idea that locking tuners is the ultimate panacea to tuning issues is an exaggeration.

Crooner. I must disagree as there is a deeper logic behind locking tuners most people simply neglect for tradition.

Sure the bigger issue always lies @ the nut, but realistically when the nut is perfectly taken care of the instrument's string windings will settle faster and be more effective w/ locking tuners.

If you line the tuning post's string hole up so that you can pull the string straight through w/ zero wraping, Lock it, you can tune every string up and have under half a winding.

Less windings means less time for the strings to settle in and its easier to maintain a tuning stability that way. I HATE stretching out my windings around the tuning post, as it messes w/ the whole tuning of the instrument for at least 30 straight minutes.

I dont have locking tuners, because mine havn't broken yet to replace them, but when I buy new after these strip or what have you I think they're worth the investment.

I basically agree with you but . . . you can accomplish the same thing without locking tuners by locking the string tail under the first wind. Only one of my current guitars has locking tuners but all of them have less than one turn of string on the tuning post.

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I mean why are you pointing out the difference in the public misconception that they fix all tuning problems, and not pointing out that they dont even advertise that they stop tuning problems. The company doesn't put that misconception out there...

I'm just saying they're worth what they're ACTUALLY advertised for... Locking and reducing windings... Just because the public praises some crappy pop musician doesn't mean they're actually decent as I'm sure you know. It's the same story.

They're worth what they're literally advertised for, but your right that they will not simply solve tuning stability.

Not a fan of applying 'best' to gear, but I will just run off the assumption that you are just looking for good tuners.

Really, going with any of the well known classic tuners will get you where you are going.

I use Sperzel locking but only because it does help me in restringing and I think that is only because I have been using them for decades and it just what I am comfortable with.

As many others have said, the locking feature hasn't ever offered me anything noticably more in, say, intonation or tuning stability than a good set of Grovers or something.

I simply don't like the stock tuners that much.
I have 18 stringed instruments of various kinds around the house and some of them have locking tuners. Locking tuners make string changing a lot easier, especially when you have a Bigsby to contend with, so that's why I want to change 'em.
I really don't wanna drill. This way, if I decide I don't like them, I can go back to the stock tuners.
Locking tuners do tend to "stay put," when I use my Floyd Rose on my old 80's guitar (where you could tune from either end) I like 'em for that reason too. So, anyway: thanks for the advice. I'mglad to know about the Planet Waves 3+3, and I'll order them today. You guys are very helpful and I appreciate it. Thanks.

I simply don't like the stock tuners that much.
I have 18 stringed instruments of various kinds around the house and some of them have locking tuners. Locking tuners make string changing a lot easier, especially when you have a Bigsby to contend with, so that's why I want to change 'em.
I really don't wanna drill. This way, if I decide I don't like them, I can go back to the stock tuners.
Locking tuners do tend to "stay put," when I use my Floyd Rose on my old 80's guitar (where you could tune from either end) I like 'em for that reason too. So, anyway: thanks for the advice. I'mglad to know about the Planet Waves 3+3, and I'll order them today. You guys are very helpful and I appreciate it. Thanks.

One more thing: When I inquired at Planet Wave, I was totally amazed at the service. The very next day, I had someone from Planet Waves E-Mail me to set me strait on exactly WHICH model would be best for the Electromatic (hence the 6 oclock thing ).
Just thought I'd add that.:cool:

Planet Waves are the ones I've been most impressed with.

Mr. Gatton Freak, You've been really helpful. You all have. Thanks to you I've just ordered my Planet Waves 3+3 machine tuners through Amazon, (Cheaper than guitar Center) and I called Planet Waves to make sure that they should fit right into my 5120 without any drilling. He assured me that they will. So, it's all cool. Now, I just have to wait, and as Tom Petty says, "The waiting is the hardest part."

Mr. Gatton Freak, You've been really helpful. You all have. Thanks to you I've just ordered my Planet Waves 3+3 machine tuners through Amazon, (Cheaper than guitar Center) and I called Planet Waves to make sure that they should fit right into my 5120 without any drilling. He assured me that they will. So, it's all cool. Now, I just have to wait, and as Tom Petty says, "The waiting is the hardest part."

Oh yeah.... I forgot to tell you that the 3+3 s cut off the excess string automatically........:cool:

Keep in mind... the general consensus is that locking tuners only aid in the speed of restringing - they don’t really aid in keeping a guitar in tune. The way to keep in tune is to lube the nut, the bridge (lightly), and, if you have a Bigsby, lube on the Bigs tension bar (again, just a little).

True but if you must Sperzel are the best I have had.

The tuners just arrived!
(much earlier than promised)
My worry is: After I install them, will the screw hole show?

The tuners just arrived!
(much earlier than promised)
My worry is: After I install them, will the screw hole show?

Thats why I said make SURE the screw hole on the new Tuners is in the 6 oclock position. It should match up perfectly!!!!

Yes, but there's 2 holes. Will they cover that 2nd hole?

I guess I'll find out in a minute... here we go...

BUMMER! They do NOT fit right in. The diameter is too small.
Now remember, I called Planet Waves and asked specifically if these 3+3 locking tuners would fit my 5120 without drilling, and they assured me that they would.
Wrong.
I am so ticked off right now....

Strange. The difference can't be that much, is it?:confused:

Yes, but there's 2 holes. Will they cover that 2nd hole?

No, but you could stick a toothpick in it, and hit the exposed end with a black magic marker to disguise it. Does it really matter if it shows? Only you will know it's there......:cool:

I hate doing any unnecessary drilling to fit tuners in a good guitar. I always cut a good bone nut and the strings never bind there. This almost always eliminates tuning issues, and I never use nut sauce or what-ever. Stock tuners haven't been a real problem for me so I wouldn't change the tuners unless I had to. Then I would hunt high and low before I drill holes.
Perhaps the Planet Waves have more than 1 kind of 3+3 tuner???

Stewart McDonald has an amazing selection of machine heads complete with detailed dimensional info. You might be able to find a match there.

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Talked to Planet Waves. It was NOT their fault.

For some reason, my Gretsch 5120 does not have 10mm holes. The holes a much smaller.
I went down to the hardware store and bought a set of drill bits so that I might increase the size of the hole gradually by moving up in sizes and then finishing it off with the 10 mm drill bit, buy my guitar guru (who is in the hospital) warned me not to do that. The angle may get messed up. He said he has a reaming tool that is specifically designed to do the job right, and if I wait for him to get out of the hospital he can fix this the right way in just a few minutes. I'm just gonna have to wait. I'm not ready to screw this up. So the stock tuners will stay on there until my luthier mends.

Why can't things just go easy? Oh well, It ain't no big thing. It'll get done eventually.
Thanks for your help everyone.

truthfully, Im terrified to ream out the holes for new locking tuners. Ive kept the stock ones on since I dont have tuning issues anymore.

truthfully, Im terrified to ream out the holes for new locking tuners. Ive kept the stock ones on since I dont have tuning issues anymore.
The stockers will do a great job for you.

The stockers will do a great job for you.

yeah ive never had a problem, outside of a week or so. but it was nothing drastic.

yeah ive never had a problem, outside of a week or so. but it was nothing drastic.
In 46+ years of playing I've worn out exactly one set of machine heads and they were very cheap ones. My current favorite machine head is the Grover Sta-Tite, as simple of a device as has ever been conceived.

A sharp drill bit is going to follow the path of the original hole unless you really ream on it, but I would suggest that you drill part way in from the back and then do the rest from the fromt. This will help to avoid paint chips.
Personally I would not do this at all unless there is a problem with the tuners. Drilling holes will always decrease the value and the look of a guitar no matter what tuners you put in. Secondly, if you are having tuning issues, this will likely not help. 9 out of 10 times, the issue is with the nut, providing the bridge is set properly.

A sharp drill bit is going to follow the path of the original hole unless you really ream on it, but I would suggest that you drill part way in from the back and then do the rest from the fromt. This will help to avoid paint chips.
Personally I would not do this at all unless there is a problem with the tuners. Drilling holes will always decrease the value and the look of a guitar no matter what tuners you put in. Secondly, if you are having tuning issues, this will likely not help. 9 out of 10 times, the issue is with the nut, providing the bridge is set properly.

<< Drilling holes will always decrease the value and the look of a guitar no matter what tuners you put in.>>

You do NOT have to drill ANY holes for the 3+3 s . The existing screw holes are correct as is. They only need 1 hole that is already there.

It COULD be as simple as excess clear coat hanging over the edge of the hole, top and bottom. ,I'll bet (without actually looking) that the stock, crap tuners have NO " barrel " like the 3+3 s do, so it doesnt matter when installing them. I've been sitting here, thinking about it. If it were me, I'd probe the top and bottom of one of the holes with my finger (or something small like a toothpick end ) to see if thats true. I've got a flex-head Dremel, and am an expert with it.

Wanna see my toenails???

Ha! Nope. Sorry. The diameters are different. I'm not stupid.
I'll show you a picture if you'd like...

Ha! Nope. Sorry. The diameters are different. I'm not stupid.
I'll show you a picture if you'd like...

OK....I wasnt trying to come off as saying you were stupid :eek:, or were you referring to someone else? :confused:

wow

i learned a lot from this thread.:)

No offense taken. I'm laughing about it. That's the problem when typing things. They can give the wrong impression.
Trust me though. I've measured. I've checked and re-checked.
For some odd reason the holes on my 5120 are smaller than the norm.
My luthier will fix it, but he's in the hospital right now, so I'll just have to wait. I don't dare to try to widen the holes myself, and he advises me not to. He says he has a special tool for the job.

No problem GF, you've been very helpful. Thanks.

Now, I'm curious :confused: as to the diameter of the holes in MY Electromatics head. :eek::eek:

Now, I'm curious :confused: as to the diameter of the holes in MY Electromatics head. :eek::eek:

Same here, as I've been thinking of getting these tuners as well. What is the exact measurement of the tuner posts?
Peter

Update:
I had a guitar tech ream the holes out (that sounds dirty) and he measured them beforehand. They definitely were NOT 10 mm. He measured.

They were more like 9 mm or less. Don't ask me why. I don't know... But he had to use 3 different hand reamers to get the holes wide enough.
Eventually the job got done, and I'm very happy with the outcome.

Stick a string through the hole, tighten it, and tune the guitar. It snips the end off without any sharp nubs sticking out. No more stabbing yourself or ruining your gig bag or case with the sharp ends that used to be left over.

Contrary to what some people think, the guitar DEFINITELY stays in tune better.

It makes string changing so much easier and faster too. 18 to 1 gear ratio. Much more responsive. Less slippage. Planet Waves - I like 'em.

I'm not a huge fan of locking tuners. I have installed a few sets. My biggest complaint is that they break strings quite easily. especially if you loosen them up to make an adjustment or something, then re tighten. The fact that there is no winding on the post, puts all of the pressure at the bend of the string. The ease of string change really isn't worth cutting 60%(guessing) of the life out of the string.

http://www.gretsch-talk.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=1320&pictureid=9468